They are probably embarrassed about the accomplishments of their west African brethren?

Relatively new here, so thanks!

Kwanza, bro. KWANZA.

Neither. They have problems building and maintaining friendships with ordinary men and of conceiving of themselves in a masculine role vis a vis women (including sexual interaction).

Stuffing bodies into a phone booth, or (headless) bodies into the trunk of a car. That sums up the difference.

Serious question: Do homos hate women, or do they want to BE women? And I guess I’m talking about the ones who aren’t the top-shelf predator types.

Lol. Join the club!

You beat me to it.

Our Elites plan to make us – non Elite whites – all live in, or near and halfway under the thumb of, a series of Baltimores.

I’m surprised you’re distinguishing between elite and non-elite whites in this regard. Your own account indicates that elite whites are as defenseless against this onslaught as are their social inferiors.

Lol. Join the club!

I always thought it hilarious that the 95% west African descended American blacks decided that Swahili, an east African language specifically developed by the slaving Swahili

That was an affectation of a scatter of low-rent academics and cretins like Albert Vann, not rank and file blacks.

Is it a new fashion to refer to blacks as black bodies?

You’re not from around these parts, are you? Steve’s been talking about “black bodies” for years:

https://isteve.blogspot.com/2014/02/jargon-alert-black-bodies.html

Checked out the article and hit the link for this guy who calls himself “Ibram X. Kendi-Mar” . Anyway, he is described as–now get this–“a professor and director of the Antiracist Research and Policy Center at American University… .” On the other hand the name alone was a dead giveaway.

A regular Bluto Blutarsky.

By the by, does the “X” stand for “the tenth”?

Yes, while Delta Upsilon engages in the occasional retaliatory homicide.

The only people who live in cities are those with no children they care about.

I love the title of his epic. I look forward to not seeing the movie.

Not only that, but I’ve actually been in several chapter houses where the kitchen wouldn’t pass inspection, and one where the emergency lighting in the stairwell didn’t work. Why Oh Why would any thinking individual ever join a college fraternity? Why Oh Why wouldn’t the Alumni Corporation owners keep their facilities as safe as those enlightened townie landlords?

Yeah, “black bodies” is signaling. I don’t read their stuff, but I think iSteve noted it as early as 2013 or so, and it was common in quotes of Teh-Genius Coates or whatever the name is. I hear it used more ironically than not.

Of course the creator of Hairspray, John Waters, doesn’t care about white girls, even in the abstract. He is a degenerate homosexual.

I think he does care about white girls, but his concern is not benevolent but rather born of jealousy, inferiority, and aggression.

Pretty white girls are the objects of desire of the homosexual’s objects of desire. Pretty white girls remind a homosexual of the life he can never have – a conventional, socially sanctioned and exalted romantic relationship with Joe Quarterback ending in a white picket fence. He needs to resolve this conflict by subverting the social order, taking revenge upon both the object of his desire and the object of Joe Quarterback’s desire.

So much of modern perversity can be explained by reference to the dog in the manger.

Roughly the comment I was going to make. Excellent!and their Arab overlords, would henceforth represent the “true language” of blacks.

I always thought it hilarious that the 95% west African descended American blacks decided that Swahili, an east African language specifically developed by the slaving Swahili
In a really odd way, they were entirely correct.

In my college experience (wayyyyy back in the 1980’s) it was pretty clear to me that most black fraternities weren’t that far off from street gangs. That’s why I’m giving the author a pass, he’s just doing what writers are supposed to do; writing what he knows.

Here’s the difference:

Frats are full of men that want to have sex with women. The women they want to have sex with are college girls who have vengeful fathers. These fathers organize themselves, and weaponize politicians and the media to pathologize the men who want to have sex with their daughters, and the social clubs these men belong to.

Gangs are full of men who want to have sex with women. The women they want to have sex with, if they even know for sure who their fathers are, they’re probably in prison or vagabonds.

“Kendi�, which means “the loved one� in the language of the Meru people of Kenya.

What’s with this fascination with EAST Africa? This is like an Irish person assuming a Turkish name.

I’m familiar with that system of classifying epochs, but I find that the overwhelming majority of these sorts of academics use the term to mean “contemporary; in the present or quite recent past.” Maybe this woman is an expert on, say, Victorian Britain, but I doubt it….

“Modern” could mean in counterpoint to “Medieval” or “ancient”. Anything since 1517 is ‘modern’ according to the broad use of the term. I wasn’t referring to her biography in particular. The others on that roster are much worse.

What if Americans treated their victims similarly?

Then we’d ask college kids to ensure that their roommates slept it off on their side or stomach, so as to avoid the risk of choking on their own vomit, after they’d been decapitated.

I don’t understand white people.

They want to be thought sophisticated and up-to-date. They are anxious about dissenting from the opinions and perspectives passed down to them by those they secretly consider their betters. They really aren’t that hard to understand. People are generally this way.

Maybe the biggest difference between a Frat and a Gang is that no self respecting Fraternity would allow Goldberg as a member, but there must be some gang somewhere that would.

Can we just have separate countries?

Ibram X. and Jeffery Goldberg–with David and Brett and Jennifer and Hillary–can have their own country and *they* can take in the 70 million Nigerians.

Actually MS-13 does that to newly arrived inmates by chasing them across the prison recreation yard and then shanking them.

The show climaxed in a confrontation where the pretty white girl protagonist embraced her new black lover declaring, “now I’ve tasted chocolate and I’m never going back!� At this point, every WASP in the theater rose as one and …

… what do you think? …

… as you said, they cheered ecstatically. Standing ovation.

I don’t understand white people.

Hahaha! The sheer distance from reality that the Atlantic writers are at is truly breathtaking. This is writing on the level of 4 AM beer philosophy: “Yeah, man, you know…a frat’s no different from a gang, really, just a band of brothers, yeah?�

Then again, I don’t think they have 4 AM beer philosophy in gangs.

I don’t even want to bother with a serious response, but for what it is worth: fraternities are largely driven by common interests and shared pursuit of nonprofit activities. Gangs as we know them are largely driven by for-profit activities, and regardless of all of the other hoodlum stuff, successful ones largely resemble some form of corporation or another.

So what’s the difference between a gang and a corporation?

He literally has a degree in white-hating racism and earns a excellent living as a professional white-hating racist. He’s part of the multi-multi-billion dollar industry of white-hating racism, an industry that is largely funded by tax dollars or mandated by government decree. Remember that when you hear a lying, lynching leftist talk about “white privilege” or “institutional racism.”

He’s lying, of course, he knows that gangs are far worse, but in multi-racial Empire America, the political entity that HAS ALREADY taken the place of the country of America, tribal politics are everything and what is needed is plausible deniability in justifying the continuation of sponging by his particular group. The hosts are beginning to not see the upside of supporting the parasites. Empire is about exploitation, and if you can’t rob them of their goods by brute force, you have to con them out of those goods with a hurricane of bullshit. That is what the “anti-racism” campaign is all about.

Nigerian fraternities like the Icelanders (German), the Klansmen Konfraternity, and the Supreme Vikings Confraternity a.k.a. De Norsemen Club of Nigeria have criminal street gang wings:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confraternities_in_Nigeria

Isn’t Kendi WOKE? Fraternities are bastions of homoerotic pledge behaviors:

Video Link

Professor Beers’s research focuses on modern Britain….

That’s the first sentence of the first biography of the first professor listed in the department of history.

The ubiquity of professors who spend all their time and energy on subjects outside the bailiwick of their training, education, and ostensible expertise has become astonishing. This woman is a historian playing at sociology or a sociologist playing at history – or something. Contrast, e.g., the great Clive Lewis who was always quick to point out he was no theologian and wrote and spoke about religion as a layman seeking to communicate with other laymen; he claimed no expertise underlying his apologetics and communications about religion whatsoever, and those were all extracurricular to his work in literature (which he spent most al of his energy on in his professorial capacity). Times have changed.

Mind you, I am no fan of fraternities! My boss is a conniving, dishonest dick who makes decisions that cheat and hurt people; Bruce Jenner is a disturbed and selfish man, and, in my opinion, guilty of vehicular manslaughter – nevertheless there are big differences between them and the guys from MS-13 who regularly kill people in my area.

Having grown up on the streets of Atlanta and having lived in and around Miami, Chicago, southern California, and large cities in California’s Central Valley, but also having attended three flagship state universities with large, active cultures of fraternities and sororities, I can state with certainty that if the writer has to ask what the difference is between a fraternity and a gang, no amount of explanation from an expert like me (or anyone else) is going to help him.

From the Big Genius Professor article:

…wafting an eerie feeling in my 14-year-old black body.

Is it a new fashion to refer to blacks as black bodies? That sub-par Obama portrait painter also preferrentially referred to blacks in this way.

What’s the Difference Between a Frat and a Gang?

How often do we see frat members shooting each other to defend their turf and/or rise in frat hierarchy?

Is LARPing a requirement for getting a degree from their institution?

Of course the creator of Hairspray, John Waters, doesn’t care about white girls, even in the abstract. He is a degenerate homosexual.

Hairspray is a John Waters creation. He is a queer product of Baltimore when it still had many eccentric whites, many of them from old line Baltimore WASP elites, many of them losing wealth. By the time of the film’s setting, it was clear that Jews were about to have near total control of the city, and that the old time WASP Elites were dying out, with a huge rise in gays (like John Waters), and that the Catholic ethnics were splitting into two camps: those that aped Jews and Mainline Protestants, and those that feared what was coming from what the Jews and Mainline Protestants were doing, especially in regard to blacks.

Today’s Baltimore is the result.

Our Elites plan to make us – non Elite whites – all live in, or near and halfway under the thumb of, a series of Baltimores.

Apparently the concept of stereotype is above the writer’s pay grade.

On the other hand, how has fraternity violence been rationalized? Not counting fictionalized violence of the Haven Monahan sort…

What’s the difference between an NFL team and a gang? Ans: Better pay.

Great idea. My first choice is Dean Wormer, but I’d settle for Dean Martin.

The topic’s a diversion from the real subject, one Tucker Carlson has been surprisingly diligent in pointing out. Assume for argument that MS-13 (significant illegal alien %) and a domestic frat are identical ethically. One of those gangs still differs from the other, having been subject to lawful prior restraint. It should have been prevented from integration.

https://www.american.edu/cas/history/faculty/index.cfm

Their history department is delineated here. The place looks like a train-wreck of friend hires friend. If the trustees of American University were worth anything, the department would be shut down and its faculty discharged en bloc.

If University Fraternities and Street Gangs are equivalents, maybe all we need to do to tackle MS-13 is to loose a crusty old fan-hating Dean on them.

A west African descendant adopts a eastern African surname.

I, a Western European descendant, will stick it to the brown supremacist culture of America by taking the Armenian surname Derderian.

Jake,

About a decade ago I attended a performance of Hairspray, about which I knew nothing, in a very WASPy Connecticut town. Hairspray turned out to be a an extended anti-white, pro-black screed in musical form. Lots of black dancing in front of white girls:

The blacker the berry Oo
The sweeter the juice Uh-h uh
The darker the chocolate Oo
The richer the taste,

Etc.

With plenty of winks, hip thrusts and innuendoes in case you didn’t get the message.

The audience was about 99.5% white, mostly Connecticut WASP families. I counted only three blacks, one of whom accompanied me.

The show climaxed in a confrontation where the pretty white girl protagonist embraced her new black lover declaring, “now I’ve tasted chocolate and I’m never going back!” At this point, every WASP in the theater rose as one and …

… what do you think? …

… as you said, they cheered ecstatically. Standing ovation.

I just sat there with my black companion thinking, “Something is seriously f**king amiss…”

AM

“But Americans stereotype the gang and fraternity differently and treat them differently and rationalize their violence differently and police them differently. What if Americans looked at them similarly? What if Americans treated them similarly? What if Americans treated their victims similarly?”

Yes, I look forward to the day when American media condemn MS-13 with the same vituperation they lavish on innocent lacrosse fraternities.

The first time I heard that question asked seriously was in either 1992 or early 1993. The asker was one of those locally esteemed young black females. One of her grandfathers was said to be a local civil rights hero still preaching the gospel and making the world a better place. Both her parents were college grads. She had a first cousin who was in Law School and known for supporting Affirmative Action because anything else was sheer racism. The person who introduced her (a white woman I later learned had a gay son and was an early proponent of gay marriage) said that she (the high school black girl of super merit) was an example of the great future of this country if only we could overcome the racist past.

The product of the Talented Tenth made her claim as part of proving the horror of racism she had to face with every breath she drew. The forum had been arranged because of an impending school board vote to ban anything that smacked of gang colors/insignia, after increased violence on and near high school campuses.

The black girl – said to be headed the next year to Wesleyan University – was opposed to any such school rules. She not only declared that fraternities were gangs just like ‘those the racist media denounces,’ she claimed that what were denounced as drug gangs usually were helpful to the local community. The girl did not name Crips or Bloods, etc, but did name Kappa Alpha, which was in the news for being accused of hazing by encouraging underage pledges to get drunk and for being all white, and then for being founded at the college where Robert E. Lee was President.

That took the girl to the Sons of Confederate Veterans, which she said was the second worst gang in American history, behind the KKK.

The audience, which was about 90% white and filled with public school teachers and college professors and students, cheered the black girl wildly – standing ovation.

“What’s the difference”, he asked in dismay,
Between gangstas and fratsters today?
It is crucial, though slight:
The fratsters be White.
Ban the Greeks and deport IXK.

Lacrosse teams are the MS-13 of white boys.

I remember that time Pike was kicked off campus for sewing a kid’s face to a soccer ball and leaving it in the middle of the student union quad. Good times.

They’re getting desperate.

So many of the leftist pets are plain obnoxious if not actually life-threatening.

So ever more bizarre statements are appearing.

I’ve been on a bit of a break, busy with another project, but like to check in at least once a week.

The headline list is definitely getting stranger and stranger.

The leftist dream will never come true. Rather than face the truth, the leftists just keep getting more bizarre as they desperately seek new excuses.

Thanks, that was pretty epic.

Video Link

Well, they don’t deal heroin or go on drive-by shootings or pimp women on a regular basis, historically black fraternities included. Next!

>MS 13 has been known to peer-pressure snitches into running naked across the quad.

😀

MS-13 would probably be as nonviolent as a fraternity if they had a corresponding gang of chicitas, call them FS-69, readily available for sex. Oh, they’d have to be hot, which may rule out most of the chicatas over 18 (when their butts balloon out), hence again, the need for fake IDs,

Does MS-13 even have a rush week? Does Modelo even come in kegs?

Ibram X. Kendi, né Ibram H. Rogers, changed his name to Kendi upon marriage to Sadiqa, she who has no U.

His Ph.D. program advisor was Molefi Kete Asante, né Arthur Lee Smith, Jr., also known as Nana Okru Asante Peasah, Kyidomhene of the House of Tafo, and Wanadoo of Gao in the court of the Amiru.

IBRAM X. KENDI is 1 of many affirmative action writers the Atlantic employs to vouchsafe its SJW cred.

“Ibram X. Kendi is a professor of history at American University and the author of Stamped from the Beginning: The Definitive History of Racist Ideas in America.” — Not a mere writer at the Atlantic but has a fine teaching gig too.

Except for being built around the idea of committing felonies including killing rivals there really is no difference a gang like MS-13 and your average fraternity. I am sure that parents make no distinction.

Do black and LGBABC fraternities get included in this comparison too?

Does pledge week for MS-13 include the brutal, sexist, xenophobic, cisgendered hazing that Haven puts the pledges through?

Clearly the nuclear Armageddon, which is becoming more and more likely every day, wouldn’t be so bad after all.

On the sliding scale of racial cynicism, finger-banging a passed-out thot is equivalent to a drive-by shooting at a funeral.

Maybe the biggest difference between a Frat and a Gang is that no self respecting Fraternity would allow Goldberg as a member, but there must be some gang somewhere that would.

The article reads like something computer-translated from another language, or written by an adolescent who hasn’t found his voice. The Coatesian references to being beat up as a kid were also intriguing. But here’s the entire “Background” portion of his Wikipedia article:

“Dr. Ibram X. Kendi was born as Ibram H. Rogers in 1982 in Jamaica, Queens. He received his undergraduate degree in Journalism and African American Studies from Florida A&M in 2004, and earned his doctorate in African American Studies in 2010 from Temple University.[5] In 2013 he married Sadiqa in Jamaica where they unveiled their new last name, “Kendi”, which means “the loved one” in the language of the Meru people of Kenya.[8] He is a New York Knicks fan.[9].”

Wikipedia also says that Dr. Kendi’s “Stamped from the Beginning: The Definitive History of Racist Ideas in America” won the 2016 National Book Award for Nonfiction.

I’m not going to read the Atlantic article, but frats do function in a couple of ways as criminal enterprises. They almost all distribute alcohol to minors. Frats also are generally accomplices to drug dealing and trafficking along with the manufacture and distribution of counterfeit government documents. Beer, pot, and fake IDs are small potatoes when it comes to crime, but virtually every fraternity has criminal activity going on.

Do most Americans think there is something wrong with the poor black gang boy and his non-white family, culture, community, and country

Yes. Criminality and low IQ.

“You don’t call your country a cunt, so don’t call your fraternity a frat.”

-Fr. Sam The Cigar Man

Fraternity men are not responsible for all, or probably not even most, of the sexual violence on college campuses these days.

Nope, that would be the football players, just ahead of the basketball players. Ain’t diversity grand!

MS 13 has been known to peer-pressure snitches into running naked across the quad.

“The Democratic party may be as frequently violent as the “savage gang MS-13,â€� as President Donald Trump called it in his State of the Union Address in January to spook fearful Americans into tough immigration policies. But Americans stereotype the gang and Democratic party differently and treat them differently and rationalize their violence differently and police them differently. What if Americans looked at them similarly? What if Americans treated them similarly? What if Americans treated their victims similarly? ”

IBRAM X. KENDI is 1 of many affirmative action writers the Atlantic employs to vouchsafe its SJW cred. Any doofus knows that inner city gangs are criminal organizations while frats, including AA frats, are status whatever blah blah blah. What’s really pathetic is this poorly argued BS gets published–embarrassing

Fraternity men are not responsible for all, or probably not even most, of the sexual violence on college campuses these days. But the same was true of gangs and urban violence in the 1990s. Violent crimes in which the urban victim identified the offender as a gang member peaked in 1996 at 10 percent of all violent crimes, according to Bureau of Justice Statistics.

Hmm, I wonder whether these sentences were penned by a statistics Ph.D. or a Harvard Law School graduate?

Gang boys are commonly cast as humanity’s problem; youth of color are demonized as super-predators. But frat boys apparently make stupid mistakes as all humans do; none of them, apparently, are super-preying on women.

Yeah, just look at the MSM’s sympathetic and proportionate treatment of Haven Monahan and Brock Turner!

Someone smarter than me could probably make a great connection here with Tom Wolfe’s novel I Am Charlotte Simmons.

“If the Red Guards attacked or humiliated you….you took your penance, kissed Maos ass and you were rehabilitated.

“This is worse. Look at Ben Affleck…..he’s apologized out the yang for not knowing this or not acting on that back in 98 or some such.

“There is no end here. There is no kiss Maos ass and the torture stops.

“There is bimbos, wannabes and nobodies keep screaming and fighting for attention and it never ends. This doesn’t just have to be stopped….this has to be neutered to the point it can never happen again…”

So how’s it going at Pizza Hut, my friend?

What does the fact that Liz Hurley is a common slut have to do with the topic at hand?

I think the point would be that people in fraught relationships with other people will say all kinds of things to third parties in the heat of the moment when things are going wrong, but that it would be pretty unusual for a woman not to know who was the father of her unborn child, given that women know pretty much which are the most fertile days of their cycle. The fact that her baby daddy said that he and she were not in exclusive relationships did not necessarily mean that she was having unprotected sex with more than one man during the same week to the extent that she was guessing who was the putative father.

Yes, I trust people producing demographic statistics more than I trust ass-pulls from alt-right combox denizens.

Do you trust those people? I don’t.

considerable doubt about the paternity of upper class English actress Liz Hurley’s son, even though she is a highly educated white women

So Liz Hurley is a common slut, and, an educated common slut, and, an upper class English common slut. What does the fact that Liz Hurley is a common slut have to do with the topic at hand? Is the point just that no one should marry the slut Liz Hurley? Because there is a host of idiots (cucks) ready to do so. And they would all be astonished to discover that the slut Liz Hurley became the adulterous Liz Hurley the instant that the cuck married her.

So what is your point?

People who collect social data for a living have already done that. They didn’t get the answer you want.

Ok, just ask any regular Black, if you know any, and ask him.

In the ghetto, 11 for girls and 12 for boys sounds about right. It also explains the high rate of STD’s.

Not interested in what your imagination tells you.

I have neither the time nor the inclination to dig into these data for accuracy.

But either way, something is amiss, and the SJWs will have to admit one way or the other that their coalition is build in unadulterated bullshit.

EITHER “rape culture” on campus is real – and one in three of their co-eds has been sexually assaulted, which is going to mean a fair number of black men on campus are rapists.

OR all the hysteria on campus about sexual assault is BS.

Which sacred cow is going to be sacrificed?

Colgate’s athletic facilities are very nice. Even the old elements are well kept. During grad school, I’d drive down from Syracuse to use Colgate’s climbing gym.

Ok, troll. I don’t think that someone should be automatically acquitted if they didn’t realize they were breaking the law. I do think sexual matters are often very complex. These types of cultural differences are a great argument against multiculturalism and mass immigration.

Do you have a link to Sotomayor saying that?

Does anybody have a link to the study with campus sexual assualt/rape accusation statistics that Yoffe brought up?

Leftist are far too earnest to realize that the Intersectionality Olympics serve as entertainment for the rest of us.

In the ghetto, 11 for girls and 12 for boys sounds about right. It also explains the high rate of STD’s.
So what percentage of Blacks are raised in ghettos? 50 to 30%? Just curious.

I have it on good authority that in the 70s pediatricians working the Cleveland public hospital near the ghetto used pseudonyms to avoid an abundance of newborns with the Drs surname. One reason the G. Washington family ended up with so many similarly named Clevelandites.

But, to repeat the logic espoused by anti-racism entrepreneur Tim Wise referring to black on white and white on black crimes, racists don’t want you to notice that Colgate Blacks and Colgate Whites have the same # of rapes alleged against them (and please don’t notice the population differentials). It is with such thundering logic that Mr Wise received a large payment to speak at my alma mater. A fee that I’m venturing has never been offered to John Derbyshire.

The reality, unfortunately, is that the average White-American isn’t high-minded at all.

This is true. It really is.

fans don’t care about bad athlete behavior

More than that, I think the fans revel in the criminal behavior of their favorite athletes, get a vicarious thrill out of it, identify with these thugs and even get turned on at the thought of them being able to just grab and fcuk any woman they want, whether she consents or not, resists or not, and nothing at all will happen to them.

What were the players thinking?

What type of group of grown men hang out with a 14 year-old girl in public? When I was in my early 20s (as the players would’v been), it would’ve been considered creepy to hang out with a female of that age.

There’s a big difference between 18 and 14. The article mentioned she looked young for her age, so it’s not like she looked mature or anything.

As I mentioned above, there’s definitely a culture of sexual entitlement among college football&basketball players. So they believe they deserve to get laid and that women should be falling at their feet. Life doesn’t work that way though, so perhaps that’s why they had a 14 year-old team groupie.

… ‘exaggeration’ is a rather anodyne way of putting it.

Deco, my old friend, you are the poster child for anodyne comments. I’m having oral surgery later this month, and may print some of them off to bring with me.

Ugly story. What were the college authorities thinking?

It is up and can be read:

http://www.espn.com/magazine/vol5no12uab.html

I work with someone who is a former teacher in an Indianapolis inner city high school. He frequently had to break up back kids having sex in the school restroom or on the stairwell, If they are acting like this in school, imagine how they must be acting outside of school.

Yea, but they need to learn, when in Rome, do as the Romans do!

I was reading “A Man in Full” when I was stopped by the cops for having a missing drivers’ license sticker while crossing into Oakland on the Bay Bridge. There were two cops and we waited on the side of the bridge amid all that fast moving traffic while we waited for the tow truck.

Then I told them the opening plot of ‘A Man in Full’ – the part where this guy in Oakland had his car towed by the police , landed in jail, and precipitated a whole series of disastrous events. I suggested that this was prophetic and the only way to escape all the pending consequences was to let me go with a warning.

Alas neither cop had heard of or had read any Wolfe. I think they thought I was just making it all up.

More evidence that the police need more literary education.

There was later a section in the paper about the difficulty black women have finding men to marry.

That’s funny, they seem to have no problem on television.

It wasn’t my assertion. ‘anon’ said that. I think when the sociologist says the age is 15 and you say the age is 9, ‘exaggeration’ is a rather anodyne way of putting it.

The link is provided above. If you compiled a full bibliography, you might find other figures among them. I doubt it’s going to be all that different. I first saw the contention that sexual initiation differed by about a year in a newspaper article 4 decades ago, so the datum has been kicking around in research literature for a while.