back to article Christmas 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

Remember the excitement of leafing through a catalog for home computer bargains? Or perhaps gazing longingly at festive tech displays in Britain's WH Smith (or ComputerLand if you lived Stateside)? Take a step back to 1984 and the last great hurrah of the 8-bit home computer. The video game crash of 1983 had already happened …

  1. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Well......

    .....my experience is a little different. From around 1979 onwards, I was looking for a computer which could do something useful for me.

    Namely....write stuff, print stuff, do spreadsheets, maybe do a bit of database.....

    The IBM PC (introduced in 1981) was very expensive (around £3000, before software was purchased).

    The Compaq Portable was very expensive.

    So in 1982 I got a £1500 loan from my bank and bought an Osborne 01.

    To get to the point....it came with a software bundle (today called "Office"), and it could do all the things I wanted.....

    ....Wordstar, Supercalc, dBase-II.....which the "8-bit Home Computers" were unable to do straight out of the box.

    1. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

      Re: Well......

      FWIW, Visicalc on the Apple ][ and a little later on the TRS-80 was the "killer app" of it's day. Not being an Apple user I don't know about WP on it, but there was Electric Pencil, Scripsit etc on TRS-80. Apple ][ had a CP/M upgrade giving access to WordStar SuperCalc and DBase. The Osbourne was an interesting device, but that screen was a bit small. Unless you needed the lug-ability, any of a number of other CP/M based computers were available at the time.

      1. nautica Silver badge
        Happy

        Re: Well......

        "...The Osbourne[sic] was an interesting device, but that screen was a bit small..."

        In Adam Osborne's inimitable style, the "...bit small..." screen (you are much too kind; it was described in the press as "...the size of a postcard...") was defended by him in several bellicose, argumentative responses as being more than large enough, as "...the displayed text was the same size as the text of an ordinary newspaper..."[paraphrase] (!)

        Osborne never did explain away the difficulty--to say nothing of the upper-body strength required--of holding a 24.5-lb, 1.4 cu.-ft machine as close as one could hold a newspaper.

      2. Marty McFly Silver badge
        Pint

        Re: Well......

        >"Not being an Apple user I don't know about WP on it"

        Apple was as self-styled then as they are now. Word Processor was "Apple Writer". And the first office suite was "Apple Works". Ah, the glorious magic of 80-column text with actual lower-case as well!

        Apple //c still lives in the attic, and I can probably find the floppy disks for those apps as well. Whether any of it still works....different question.

        1. Andrew Scott Bronze badge

          Re: Well......

          found 2 apple II+ computers with monitors and dual floppy drives in an unused room next to a conference/classroom a couple of weeks ago. There were other computers in the room probably as old and at least one printer. Trying to get the to retire the machines and free up the room. no luck so far.

    2. CountCadaver Silver badge

      Re: Well......

      According to an online inflation calculator that comes to about £6700 today....

      1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

        Re: Well......

        8 bits ?

        In my day if you wanted to calculate log tables you had to machine the gear wheels yourself

        1. Neil Barnes Silver badge

          Re: Well......

          We had to make our own log tables, from trees with square roots.

          1. Will Godfrey Silver badge
            Pint

            Re: Well......

            Nice one!

            Have one of these :)

          2. J. R. Hartley

            Re: Well......

            "We had to make our own log tables, from trees with square roots."

            Luxury.

            1. The man with a spanner

              Re: Well......

              All volumetric measures in cubits please!

              1. dan_linder
                Angel

                Re: Well......

                > All volumetric measures in cubits please!

                Noah?

        2. Efer Brick

          Re: Well......

          Luxe! Ours were made from stone, 25megaliths, but we wur'appy

          1. Neil Barnes Silver badge

            Re: Well......

            Bloody litho-computer waste. It's always easier to upgrade to a new 50-megalith device, and leave the old one cluttering up the countryside.

    3. martinusher Silver badge

      Re: Well......

      That's exactly what I did. I had all sorts of useful software for it including real programming languages and the 'office' type programs. I used it for real work, even carrying it around with me (that sucker was still heavy, though -- like carrying a sewing machine). I used it with a Brother daisy-wheel printer, it wasn't as versatile as a dot-matrix but the result looked a lot more professional.

      However, by Christmas 1984 it was abandoned, left in the UK to what became an uncertain fate. I was offered a job in California working for one of the numerous PC clone companies so by Christmas I was using PC type machines, both desktop and 'transportable' (the transportable clone that I still have was an XP copy that had a much larger screen than the Osborne). So I missed all those Spectrums and what-have-you -- naff systems all, the only one I thought worth the time of day being the Jupiter "ACE", a FORTH system (and I had FORTH on both the Osborne and the Corona so it was really just a toy).

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Well......

      "The 8-bit computers couldn't do it, so I bought an 8-bit computer!"

      Seriously? Do you have any idea how dumb that sounds? No idea why you got a single upvote.

      1. Ian Johnston Silver badge

        Re: Well......

        Perhaps because s/he was making a distinction between 8-bit home computers and business-oriented systems of the time?

      2. ICL1900-G3 Silver badge

        Re: Well......

        Downvoted for unpleasantness.

    5. An_Old_Dog Silver badge
      Windows

      Re: Well......

      1. I desired, but could not afford, the Kaypro II 8-bit luggable. It had a reasonably-large screen, 80x24 (25?)-libe display, a word processor, darabase program, etc., but most-importantly, had their structured SuperBASIC (if-then-else blocks, while loops, etc.)

      2. Arcade games vs home computer games: the thing which kept myself and others pouring coins into video arcade console games was their large, colorful, high-res screens, magnitudes better than what you could get on any personal computer. PCs got much better, and the arcade games failed to keep their magnitudes-better technological lead. ISTR Atari's "Tempest" video arcade game was the last and best of that line. (It used a color, vector display, rather than a rasterized one.)

      3. Similarly, TV console games were -- in my mind, at least -- too expensive for the quality of sound and graphics you got. It was better to get a home computer, which could play games, and do ordinary computer-stuff (word processing, databases, spreadsheets, and programming).

      4. A friend had a Sinclair QL, and I thought it was great, except for those damned proprietary Stringy Floppies. A (or THREE) cassette tape interface(s) would have been better. 3 tapes would have allowed traditional master_tape + transactions_tape ==> new_master_tape processing, which is pretty much what you have to do when you don't have disc drives.

      5. A full-travel mechanical keyboard was/is a must for me. I bought a used VIC-20 with modem to use as a terminal, pulled out the keyboard, built a 30-foot extension cable, and mounted the keyboard on a little piece of wood, with a riser to tilt the KB, and an epoxied-on remote RESET switch mounted under the KB. With all those unshielded telephone wires in the extension cable hanging out, it still worked reliably! Later, I got a C-64 wirh a 1541 diskette drive, and an word-processing quality printer.

      6. The ZX had a place as a cheap base for hardware mods. An EE student friend was showing me his homebuilt RAM expansion, made a mistake, and bricked his ZX. He bought a replacement ZX for US$20.00 that afternoon, came back, and completed his project.

      1. tango_uniform

        Re: Well......

        Re your point #2...Atari made a number of B/W and color vector-graphics games. Tempest was followed by titles like Black Widow (a dual-joystick shooter that was one of my faves since I also loved Robotron from Williams), Space Duel and, of course, Star Wars. See here for the list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Atari_arcade_games

        As the hardware got better, raster graphics took over since they can do the one thing that's tough on any vector display: textured area fills.

  2. Bebu sa Ware
    Windows

    "if I couldn't write a mouse driver, I didn't deserve a mouse."

    Absolutely golden.

    British best practice customer relations.

    "That's the way to do it."

    Should be more of it. :)

    I can just imagine Mr and Mrs Torvalds telling a young Linus "if you cannot write a proper multitasking operating system you don't deserve a 386."

    1. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

      Re: "if I couldn't write a mouse driver, I didn't deserve a mouse."

      I was wondering if the author meant to write AMX mouse. I've not heard of an AMS mouse for a BBC. If it was an AMX mouse, it should have come with s/w. It wasn't sold any other way at the time. Unless it was a refurb/return/some kind of cock-up the Watford guy couldn't be bothered to sort out.

      1. Dan 55 Silver badge

        Re: "if I couldn't write a mouse driver, I didn't deserve a mouse."

        Perhaps a WE version where they sometimes even supplied drivers which worked with varying degrees of success?

        Looking at an old ad on page 5, it looks like it was the £29 "mouse only" but it's unclear what you're supposed to order to get a driver. In any case their NEW SUPERART software worth £15 looks like it was only given away, absolutely FREE, with the £59 mouse, although in the list it's sold separately for £39. The difference between the £29 and £59 mouse is also left to the customer's imagination. Who knows what they're ordering? Probably not even WE.

      2. Ian Johnston Silver badge

        Re: "if I couldn't write a mouse driver, I didn't deserve a mouse."

        Were Watford Electronics the people whose adverts were headed "SUPER DEAL? NO, SUPER STEAL."

      3. Peter Gathercole Silver badge

        Re: "if I couldn't write a mouse driver, I didn't deserve a mouse."

        The AMX mouse was made by a company called "Advanced Memory Systems", so I have seen it written as AMS mouse as well as AMX mouse.

        It required a sideways ROM which provided the interrupt handling code and some extra drawing commands and some basic applications, but any other software needed to be loaded from disk.

        The standard package included an "AMX Art" package which strongly resembled Mac Paint, together with a number of other demos.

        Later, there was a "Super Art" package which also included some 3D modelling facilities (it came with a wireframe helicopter demo which was very impressive for an 8-bit micro).

        Watford sold their own mouse as well as the AMX one, and I believe that this could be bought on it's own. They did their own ROM to support it, but they did also sell Sideways RAM boards (wink wink). Both the AMX Art and the Super Art ROMs would run from sideways RAM, although it may have required a write-protect switch.

        Unlike PC mice, the BBC AMX mouse plugged into the user port (one of the 6522 VIA ports on the model B). The individual IR decoders directly fed input lines in the port, which made the mouse very simple compared to mice on other systems, but needed the driver to be more complicated. Interestingly, it was a three button mouse at a time when other mice only had one or two buttons.

        AMS also produced a mouse package for other 8-bit micros as well.

        I believe that Acorn User did actually carry an article in one of their editions that detailed how to interact with it or any compatible mouse if you didn't have the ROM.

    2. Pascal Monett Silver badge
      Windows

      Re: "if I couldn't write a mouse driver, I didn't deserve a mouse."

      Yeah but, if that's how we handled the computing revolution, we wouldn't be posting stuff here.

      And I wonder what that guy was doing about his car. Did he overhaul the engine every year ? If not, did he deserve a car ?

    3. 'bluey

      Re: "if I couldn't write a mouse driver, I didn't deserve a mouse."

      I hope the cock that said that reads this article with shame...

      And the brits wonder why none of their small companies can become big.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: "if I couldn't write a mouse driver, I didn't deserve a mouse."

        Let's just say that this outfit had something of a reputation.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: "if I couldn't write a mouse driver, I didn't deserve a mouse."

        you're fired!

    4. UnknownUnknown

      Re: "if I couldn't write a mouse driver, I didn't deserve a mouse."

      I remember the people at Watford Electronics, Viglen and Dabhand Computjng all being lovely.

      Well until Dabs was sold to BT .. and ultimately morphed into BT Shop. Same as my part of BT It was part of BT Enterprises - ran ‘agile/start-up’ outside of BT Corporate until a reorganisation smashed it to pieces. Dabs, BT Fleet, BT Property, Expedite, BT Legal Services.

    5. bazza Silver badge

      Re: "if I couldn't write a mouse driver, I didn't deserve a mouse."

      "If I couldn't write a mouse driver, I didn't deserve a mouse".

      I took the opposite approach. Change the electronics, instead of writing a device driver.

      I came across a track ball surplus from the Royal Navy - a giant yellow plastic ball with considerable inertia, but a really nice and slick action. Mechanically, it was superb, which is why I wanted to use it. BTW the size was due to the need for this to be usable by a crew member wearing bulk anti-flash protective gear.

      However, to get it working with a PC I decided to tinker with the electronics inside to make it compatible with something that already existed (an early MS serial mouse if memory serves), rather than write software to make it work as-is. Worked a treat!

  3. This post has been deleted by its author

    1. CountCadaver Silver badge

      I think you mean under 35.

      I'm early 40s and I had a cpc464 as a kid with a tape deck and cousins with a spectrum again with a tape deck so I'm well versed in the loading sounds and crossing fingers that it didn't throw an error and the glacial loading times....

      Dizzy is long overdue a new life

      Ditto Zool on the Amiga

      1. milliemoo83
        Happy

        "Ditto Zool on the Amiga"

        You may be interested in Zool: Redimensioned.

      2. Dan 55 Silver badge

        How about Wonderful Dizzy (released in 2020)?

      3. azalea

        The control scheme may be eggsasperating, but sure, Dizzy was a good egg. Zool though? Superfrog was better, and that was a poor platformer.

    2. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

      "Philips compact cassette" should suffice. They can google it. Came out a year before me.

  4. Henry Hallan
    Headmaster

    Glory Days

    The Pi 400/500 are doing a little more than recapturing the glory days of the BBC micro. The ARM CPU that gives them life was designed by Acorn, intending to be a coprocessor for the BBC micro.

    They are more like a descendant - they carry Acorn DNA, as it were.

    1. Will Godfrey Silver badge
      Happy

      Re: Glory Days

      They also appeal to those of us who like to play/work with computers, rather than on them. (Although we do a bit of that as well)

      1. nautica Silver badge
        Thumb Up

        Re: Glory Days

        "There is a computer disease that anybody who works with computers knows about. It's a very serious disease and it interferes completely with the work. The trouble with computers is that you 'play' with them!"---Richard P. Feynman

    2. werdsmith Silver badge

      Re: Glory Days

      My memory of BBC Micro is that it was out of reach expensive. I knew one family that went into debt to get one. Never got my hands on or near one.

      Whereas Raspberry Pi stuff is dirt cheap. Acorn may have made the superior machine but it was little use if they were out of reach then they were no use, which is why Sinclair succeeded in the 8 bit era. If you exclude the BBCs purchased by the tax payer, Sinclair outsold Acorn about 20 to 1.

      1. David 132 Silver badge
        Thumb Up

        Re: Glory Days

        Indeed. Looking at the old circa-1987 ad that Dan 55 posted further up this page, I was struck by how high the prices seemed, even by 2024 standards. Allowing for inflation, they were almost stratospheric at the time.

        My own parents bought me a Sinclair Spectrum+ for Christmas '84; my school had a room full of BBC Bs and a couple of Masters, and I wanted one of those, but their pricing was screw-you high for all but schools and the most affluent middle classes. IIRC, my Spectrum+ was £179, and a BBC B at the time was something like £399 (and £499? for a Master).

        1. Tron Silver badge

          Re: Glory Days

          BBC micros were only owned by rich kids and schools. The Sinclair machines were a miracle of electronics and consumer nouse, despite the rough edges. The tech development from the ZX80 to the 4 chips ZX81 and then to the Spectrum in two years was the computing equivalent of going from the Championship to the Premiership and then winning the Champions league the following season. I don't recall the pace of tech change, for consumers, being that fast since. They blew it sticking microdrives on the QL. A cost saving too far. As I recall it came with a free Works package. It was very nearly there. One mistake was all it took. And there were so many players that tried to compete on price, nobody could make any cash any more. It has always been almost impossible to find proper investment to develop tech in the UK. The QL's Z8000 was 16 bit but most of the companies found the step up difficult. The market split. Compaq laid the legal groundwork for PC clones, at which point the business market headed towards the safe conformity of DOS and Windows. Games didn't need keyboards so you could save manufacturing cash and avoid people copying your tapes with a console running cartridges. Acorn carried on, subsidised by its education sales, but just charged too much. Their machines were neither one thing nor the other. Not compatible enough for business, not cheap enough for the home. The chips survived and now power everything. Sadly the transputer didn't have so much success. If it could have lasted a bit longer, things may have been different. I really hope they release a Pi on a PC mobo, maybe with an accompanying quiet PSU, and a Pi laptop to go head to head with Chromebooks. I love the old school form factor, but you need to target different markets in different ways.

          1. Furbian
            Go

            Re: Glory Days

            The QL had a 68008, it was a 16-bit CPU with an 8-bit bus, the 68000, proper 16-bit, was used in the Atari ST, Commodore Amiga and Mac. Yes, the BBC was very expensive £400 vs £130 for the Spectrum, only one pupil out of over 1000 in the school had one. However the BBC Micro was a far superior tool for teaching coding, with in-line assembler with an excellent (compared to the rest) version of Basic. Don't forget its mode 7 drove Teletext (anyone remember the actual forerunner to internet news?). It was also linked to BBC programmes to boost computing literacy, the Sinclair ZX Spectrum was great for the home, but not much else, it fell well short of the BBC brief and did not have anything like the BBC's hardware or array of expansion peripherals, such as the Z80 second processor for running CP/M. As for becoming a business machine, they tried and failed to make an impact in the US; apart from ARM (which is technically Japanese-owned and is listed on the Nasdaq) no major technology has ever been able to establish itself in the US, e.g. Nokia, Vodafone etc.

            1. doublelayer Silver badge

              Re: Glory Days

              "apart from ARM (which is technically Japanese-owned and is listed on the Nasdaq) no major technology has ever been able to establish itself in the US, e.g. Nokia, Vodafone etc."

              If you're talking about the average consumer, Nokia was relatively successful in the US. In 2005, it was the third highest seller of mobile phones in that market. It didn't continue to succeed there for the same reason that it didn't continue its even more dominant position in the European market: it didn't match its earlier smartphones to the feature set of competing smartphones for a few years, then Microsoft bought it and prevented it from doing so for a few more years, and by the time it tried to fix things, it was too late. Curiously, it seems Nokia (the brand, actually HMD)was fifth by market share in the US for mobile phones in 2022. I'm not sure if they stayed there, but that's surprisingly high for a company that makes relatively unimpressive hardware compared to their earlier status.

            2. Dan 55 Silver badge

              Re: Glory Days

              The Spectrum never needed a second Z80 to run CP/M, just a suitable memory map with RAM at the bottom of the memory, which unfortunately it didn't get until the +3.

            3. electricmonk

              Re: Glory Days

              Don't forget its mode 7 drove Teletext (anyone remember the actual forerunner to internet news?).

              No it didn't. The BBC Micro had a mode that emulated the standard Teletext layout, but I don't think one ever drove the BBC's Ceefax service, which was launched in 1975 - way before the BBC Micro came along - and was served up by a mainframe, eventually superseded by a custom system developed by Logica, according to this BBC article.

              1. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: Glory Days

                BBC Ceefax and the ITV/C4 services ran on various Vaxen from c.1980 to its final death throes. Logica sounds right - they did a lot in the broadcast sphere at that time.

                Never knock teletext. For many people (ie. not those who had the early 80's home computers, aka Reg Readers) it was the first microprocessor system in the domestic residence. It was also the most accurate clock you could get at home for many years. And the first freely available information server, albeit a bit slow and quirky and no return path.

                The internet/online data world owes a lot to teletext. Though the Americans never really saw the point in it. I remember seeing an american TV "expert" in the late 90's telling us all how digital TV would enable everyone to pull up a datapage of facts and figures about the programme being watched and other information. "A bit like teletext has done for 20 years?" someone in the audience asked. And the speaker looks bewildered - had no idea what teletext was, but was evangelising to the world about digital TV technology.

                1. Terry 6 Silver badge

                  Re: Glory Days

                  Teletext provided news and information, pure and simple. No distractions,. No upselling. No spin or "framing," No significant marketing. Everything that the "Tech Bros" of today would hate.

              2. Peter Gathercole Silver badge

                Re: Glory Days

                Acorn had a Teletext adapter as an add-on for the BBC micro (it plugged into the 1MHz bus), which allowed it to receive Ceefax. It was basically a TV tuner and fed the first 6 lines of the screen through to a decoder which would display the text on the screen. I see no reason why it wouldn't work with any other compatible teletext broadcast.

                It was very clever, because it could buffer pages so that they were available instantly, rather than having to wait for them to cycle around on a TV's teletext system. Another innovation was that it provided an BBC Micro OS compliant filesystem that could be accessed from Basic or any other language. Page numbers were accessed as files, so you could read information from a page into a program.

                I believe that the BBC also experimented with delivering computer programs through the teletext adapter to the BBC micro, as you could "LOAD" a file from the teletext filesystem!

                With a suitable modem and a terminal emulator, the BBC Micro could also do Prestel, which was the BT information and bulletin board, which also used the same screen encoding.

                Mode 7 (the teletext mode) was actually a design requirement from the BBC for 'their' micro, which also provided the benefit of a low-memory use screen mode to maximise the memory availability on the BBC Micro.

                1. David 132 Silver badge

                  Re: Glory Days

                  I well remember the Acorn Teletext adapter; my school had one of them, in one of the primary school classrooms. I used it once or twice, what must have been 40 years ago now. As I recall it was the same size, and Acorn Beige colour, as the "Tube" second processor unit.

                  Aaaand that's just sent me down the Ebay rabbit-hole. Who knew that there's now such a thing as a USB-C PSU replacement for the BBC B??? I am impressed.

          2. Dan 55 Silver badge

            Re: Glory Days

            The closest thing to a mass produced computer which used a Z8000 was the Commodore 900 but that was cancelled after they bought Amiga.

            1. mike.dee

              Re: Glory Days

              There was the Olivetti M20 that had a Z8001 processor. It was possible to run a Z8000 version of CP/M, a prorietary OS named PCOS, and with the optional 8086 board MSDOS.

              It was commercialized in 1982, but in 194 Olivetti made available the M24, that was almost fully IBM compatible, and the M20 wasn't made anymore.

            2. Peter Gathercole Silver badge

              Re: Glory Days

              I actually had one in our "computer appreciation" lab in the early '80s at the Poly. I was working at that we set up to demonstrate what computers could do, to people who had never seen one at that time. I had the time and the opportunity to see what it could do.

              Was great fun playing with all of the hardware, which included 16 BBC micros, robot arms, two different video digitiser systems, graphic input tablets, light pens, touch screens, high precision joysticks (Bitstick), mice, speech synthesizers, second processors (6502 and Z80), the aforementioned Teletext adapter, a pen plotter, and Acornsoft ROM based Pascal and VIEW packages, all linked together with Econet 3 to a file server with a 20MB hard disk and a networked printer.

              Doing general demo's when a new class came in, or on an open day, was a lot of fun getting it out and working all at the same time.

        2. Terry 6 Silver badge

          Re: Glory Days

          Somewhere in that period ( according to PCW magazine at the time) the US manufacturers tried to kickstart computer sales in teh UK by offering very big discounts to the importers/resellers. Who pocketed the dibs for themselves and kept the prices high.

          In the UK there is a long tradition of this in business anyway. Not just in IT. Many companies would have preferred to sell 10000 units with £10 profit on each rather than 20000 units with £8 profit on each.As my dad explained it,( he ws working in the raq trade) they seemed to feel that the £2 reduction was robbing them personally- like their teeth were being pulled

      2. Terry 6 Silver badge

        Re: Glory Days

        Which is why I bought my Electron- as prices dropped. And peripherals from said Watford Electronics to build up its capacities. Taught myself BASIC and 6502 assembly language and wrote a few very useful programmes- which I then did nothing with, probably should have marketed at least one of them. I guess that's why I'm not a billionaire.

    3. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

      Re: Glory Days

      ...and as for the "computer in a keyboard", most of us reading here are probably using a laptop. Who here has never plugged a laptop into an external monitor, in some cases because the screen is broke? I can't be the only one who has removed the laptop screen completely and used it as a "computer in a keyboard" just because :-)

      1. Loudon D'Arcy

        Re: Glory Days

        You're not alone, John. Headless laptops are indeed a "thing"...

        https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=headless+laptop

    4. Soruk
      Boffin

      Re: Glory Days

      The ARM wasn't intended to BE a BBC Micro co-processor, but this is how the original chips were tested, and the ARM Evaluation System was shipped in that form for early users to use it and start writing software for the processor. Its intended target was the Archimedes.

      1. David 132 Silver badge
        Thumb Up

        Re: Glory Days

        For a period of maybe a couple of months circa 1987 I lusted after the Archimedes A3000, until I saw an Amiga A500 running a demo in a store instead, which blew me away and set me on my Amiga path!

  5. Anonymous Coward
    1. This post has been deleted by its author

  6. Howard Sway Silver badge

    1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

    It may have been the last hurrah for the manufacturers being able to sell them in vast quantities, but the machines that were sold had a long life of being used, and software continued to be produced and sold in vast quantities for years afterwards. My C64 was in heavy use from 1983 to 1988 and other people happily used them for much longer. The relative simplicity of the machine, and the ease with which every bit of it was directly accessible for programming gave me and many others a foundation in programming principles that got harder to get as more complex generations of machines arrived.

    1. Dan 55 Silver badge

      Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

      I'm also not sure why 1984 is being headlined the last hurrah for the 8-bits, the Spectrum was sold until 1992, the C64 until 1994, and the software lasted longer.

      The PC Engine was released as late as 1997 and was sold until 1994, the NES lasted until 1995 outside Japan and 2003 in Japan.

      On paper the 8-bits were superseded in 1985 but in the real word there life in the old dog yet. Sort of like seeing 80s houses in present-day films, it looks like some hallucinogenic neon decoration but in the real world houses had decorations and furniture from the 70s or even 60s.

      1. Loudon D'Arcy

        Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

        > On paper the 8-bits were superseded in 1985 but in the real word there life in the old dog yet.

        ^This. The Amiga 1000 may well have been released in (late) 1985, but it cost $1300. The ST was $1000 with a colour monitor. It wasn't until 1987 that the Amiga 500 was released, and even then, it didn't really take off in the UK until the price was cut to £399 in the middle of 1988. We were all still using our 8-bit machines well into the late 1980's.

        > Sort of like seeing 80s houses in present-day films, it looks like some hallucinogenic neon decoration but in the real world houses had decorations and furniture from the 70s or even 60s.

        Don't get me started. If I see another TV "re-creation" of the 1980's where everyone's dressed like a member of Kajagoogoo, I'm gonna scream.

        1. Uncle Slacky Silver badge
          Windows

          Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

          > We were all still using our 8-bit machines well into the late 1980's.

          Indeed, I bought my Amstrad CPC6128 (with a colour screen!) for GBP399 in 1986, took it to uni and back (everyone else had STs or Amigas by then) and used it until about 1994. It's still in the attic, though I haven't switched it on for at least 20 years. I know the drive belt will need replacing if I ever get around to it. Hasn't stopped me writing new software for it, though:

          https://github.com/UncleSlacky/Renderfast

        2. David 132 Silver badge
          Pint

          Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

          Who else, when looking through the 1984 Argos catalogue linked from the article, found themselves saying "ooh! I remember my parents having that crockery set! and that's the portable TV I had in my bedroom to use with my computer!"

          Just me?

          Here's to nostalgia. Pint of real ale--->

          1. munnoch Silver badge

            Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

            I recognise the first set of pots I bought when I moved into my own place!

            Growing up in the countryside I hadn't actually heard of Argos until I started Uni in the Big City in 1985. In our household it was the Kays catalogue that brought the world to our doorstep.

            1. The commentard formerly known as Mister_C Silver badge

              Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

              Wilkinsons. They were an eye opener into the world of equipping a home. And also allowed me to frame a simple rule for rating a town's prosperity as inversely proportional to the size of their Wilco

              1. Jou (Mxyzptlk) Silver badge

                Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

                > rating a town's prosperity as inversely proportional to the size of their Wilco

                What https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilco_(disambiguation) ???? Even inside the US-A it is not clear, let alone outside...

                1. Loudon D'Arcy

                  Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

                  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilko

                  1. Jou (Mxyzptlk) Silver badge

                    Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

                    Thank you! So it is Wilko and not Wilco. But I bet I still beat "The commentard formerly known as Mister_C" in typo count and weird grammar :D.

      2. Dan 55 Silver badge
        Facepalm

        Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

        * "The PC Engine was released as late as 1987"

        I think I need a half-hour edit window.

        1. werdsmith Silver badge

          Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

          Amstrad CPC were Z80 based and in production until 1990.

          1. Uncle Slacky Silver badge

            Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

            And the PCWs even longer, at least until 1998 (PcW16).

      3. doublelayer Silver badge

        Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

        "the NES lasted until 1995 outside Japan and 2003 in Japan."

        Wasn't this the point, that this didn't really count because it was only a game machine? The processor inside it doesn't matter to the article's point if it's a single-purpose device that only ran games and you couldn't write other things for it. So even if you could continue to buy them, did any significant 8-bit home computers get designed after 1984?

        Bonus discussion topic: does this matter? Why is a 16-bit home computer different or worse than a 8-bit one?

        1. Uncle Slacky Silver badge

          Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

          I did a little research a while back and it appears that the last "new" 8-bit home computer was probably the Amstrad PcW16 in 1995:

          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amstrad_PCW#PcW16

          1. David 132 Silver badge
            Happy

            Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

            And knowing Alan Sugar, that was probably because he got a job lot of Z80 processors cheap from a warehouse clearance and figured out a way to flog them. Putting "16" in the model name was totally not intended to deceive people into thinking it was a 16-bit machine :)

            Lovely jubbly!

            1. Nugry Horace

              Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

              The PcW16 didn't have a discrete Z80 chip - the Z80 was incorporated in the gate array.

        2. Dan 55 Silver badge

          Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

          did any significant 8-bit home computers get designed after 1984

          Off the top of my head... Commodore C128, Spectrum 128K/+2/+2A/+3, BBC Master, Cambridge Z88, Apple IIc+, SAM Coupé, Amstrad 464+/6128+ as well as the Amstrad PCWs mentioned by the poster above.

          1. Uncle Slacky Silver badge

            Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

            IIRC the Sam Coupe was also the last "new" computer that came with a cassette interface...

            1. Dan 55 Silver badge

              Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

              Unfortunately loading a 150-200K game from cassette was an exercise in proving that tape didn't scale. It must have been the best part of 20 minutes.

          2. Blazde Silver badge

            Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

            did any significant 8-bit home computers get designed after 1984

            Off the top of my head... Commodore C128, Spectrum 128K/+2/+2A/+3, BBC Master, Cambridge Z88, Apple IIc+, SAM Coupé, Amstrad 464+/6128+ as well as the Amstrad PCWs

            It's undeniable sales in the segment tanked though.

            I think one factor not really touched on is that there was a very healthy second-hand market for these 'cheap' 8-bit computers, and the extra features later models brought were never enough to justify upgrading (the ZX Spectrum shedding it's awful rubber keyboard excepted). The segment became a victim of it's own success, and then failed to innovate enough to drive new sales.

            So as families upgraded to IBM-compatibles, and kids had played as much Boulder Dash as anyone can play in a lifetime, or moved on to consoles because they never cared for hacking BASIC, the older machines got sold to those of us who did want to write code. New games were still being released for a long time, traded & copied too obviously. Overall the relentless 12-monthly hardware obsolescence cycle of the mid-90s (coinciding with IBM-compatibles becoming more affordable) hadn't yet kicked in so, in say 1990, buying a home computer or game console first released in 1983 (either first or second-hand) wasn't that unusual.

            1. Dan 55 Silver badge

              Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

              I don't agree sales tanked after 1984. 3 million CPCs, 7 million PCWs, shall we say 3.5 million Spectrums (7/10ths of the 5 million Spectrums sold in its lifetime), 9 million C64s/C128s. The 8-bits outsold the Amiga and ST. Things took off after the number of 8-bit systems was reduced down to something manageable, in spite of the 16-bit systems.

              And if you were patient and had a CPC, PCW, C64 (perhaps with GEOS) could be fairly easily persuaded to do business tasks. You'd have to be very dedicated to try and do that with the Spectrum though.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

      And new 8-bit home computers are still being built today. The Commander X16 just got released in the last few years (and despite the name it's an 8-bit machine with a 65C02 processor).

      The next batch of boards is supposed to ship by January 31.

      1. Loudon D'Arcy

        Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

        And the release of the X16 appears to have inspired more new 8-bit machines...

        The Pi Hut: AgonLight2 - Z80 BBC Basic Retro Single Board Computer

        The Pi Hut: Olimex Neo6502

        1. Dan 55 Silver badge

          Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

          The Agon guy would say he got there first, amongst other things.

          I also think that if you're going to do something nowadays it's best to use obtainable parts (Spectrum Next, X65, Agon boards, Mega 65 apart from the floppy drive) rather than depend on recycled chips from China which could stop at any time.

          There is a nice home computer version of the Agon by the way.

        2. David 132 Silver badge

          Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

          Also the very fine Spectrum Next that I have right in front of me on my desk here!

          Z80 compatible, with a colossal 2MB of RAM, near-instantaneous SD card storage, and up to a 28MHz core clock speed. 10-year-old me would have been insufferably smug in front of the other kids at school :)

    3. juice

      Re: 1984: The last hurrah for 8-bit home computers

      > It may have been the last hurrah for the manufacturers being able to sell them in vast quantities, but the machines that were sold had a long life of being used, and software continued to be produced and sold in vast quantities for years afterwards

      Agreed - for me, 1984 was arguably the beginning of the end, rather than an actual last hurrah. For instance, the revamped Amstrad Spectrum range (i.e. the +2, +2A and +3) wasn't released until 1986, and sold somewhere around 3 million units.

      Instead, 1984 is perhaps best viewed as a winnowing; with so many incompatible machines on the market, it was inevitable that the weaker ones would fail to reach a sustainable userbase.

      Arguably, that actually led to something of a golden age; with just two main ecosystems[*] and Moore's Law driving down prices, people started to delve deeper into what the hardware could actually do.

      In fact, I'd say that 1988 was arguably the last hurrah. To give an example: in 1984, Jet Set Willy on the ZX Spectrum was viewed as state-of-the-art, with it's 60 static "flip" screens. However, by 1986, we had fully 3d-wireframe games such as Starglider, and by 1988, Where Time Stood Still gave us a massive scrolling isometric adventure. WIth dinosaurs.

      On the other hand, while video games measurably improved, the same can't really be said about productivity software; the only real way to improve these was to switch to 16-bit hardware. There's perhaps a case to be made that being able to address extra RAM was the main driver, as this let you use higher resolutions, use more colours and edit larger documents.

      And when the 16-bit machines ran out of steam, the IBM PC was ready to take over; the architecture may have been slow and crude, but the economies of scale were literally unbeatable!

      [*] The Commodore and Spectrum, natch. Three if you include the Amstrad CPC, four if you want to extend things to include the BBC...

  7. Willy Ekerslike

    Nostalgia

    I still have my ZX81 and Acorn Electron (compete with Plus 1, Plus 3 and Plus 5 accessories, a 6502 co-pro and a 5.14" FDD, and word processing and spreadsheet cartridges). Come to that, my Psion II and 3a (plus accessories) are up there, along with various laptops and PC software packages (WordPerfect 5.1, Paradox 3.5, ObjectVision, QuattroPro to name a few I can remember). At the start of the year it was scattered around various boxes up there but my 2024 resolution was to try and do some loft tidying. A lot of paperwork got shredded/recyclyed (including copious university course notes and old business accounts); my old hiking and camping gear went to the local Scouts, and my old photographic gear (various film and digital cameras and darkroom kit) went to a daughter who has an artistic flair.

    All the digital kit was moved to one pile. Back in the spring I emailed a few computer museums and offered them the lot, but no takers. I've no interest in resurrecting so I guess it will all end up in the local recycling skips when the kids/grandkids clear out my home (though I'm not planning to shuffle off just yet)!

    1. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

      Re: Nostalgia

      Try listing the stuff on a retro computing forum. At the very least, someone may offer to drive over and take the lot, saving you a trip to the tip. Best case, you trigger a bidding war and make a little dosh :-)

      Most collectors will take more or less anything because they know they can grab the stuff they really want and know people who will want any stuff they don't need/want.

      1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

        Re: Nostalgia

        The only bit of kit I would like back today is my Psion5

  8. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    A bit later than that...

    ...home computers didn't really die until Windows 95. The 486 was the first processor that started to really turn the screws on the 68000. PCs were still highly expensive at that point: $2000 in the mid 90s....

    1. Phones Sheridan Silver badge

      Re: A bit later than that...

      Sort of. I was at Salford Tech college in 1991, went from an Amiga 500 to 486 SX25 that year. It cost me £1200 new from PAL computers in Stockport. I got it with DOS and Windows 3.x (and bought Coherent 3 from Grey Matter specifically because Salford was heavily into Solaris at the time and we needed Unix for the coursework). The cost was 5 times what I paid for the Amiga the year before. And it sucked at games. Yes you had Battle Chess, but it had Sinclair spectrum 48 levels of 1 bit sound, until I could afford a Sound Blaster 8 bit a year later. Around 93 when Doom and X-Wing came out was when the tables turned, and the Amiga started to get left behind at that point.

    2. airbrush

      Re: A bit later than that...

      My first pc was an amstrad 286 with a total of 1MB of ram and monochrome monitor for £500 I think, a 386 was a couple of hundred more in 1991.

      1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

        Re: A bit later than that...

        Mine was an 8086 Olivetti Portable ( twin 720K floppy, 512Kb ram, mono cga display and dos) and was also £500 from Morgans on New Oxford St - I still miss pressing my nose to their window

  9. Vulch

    The Box Of Delights

    Curemtly available on iPlayer for the next 11 months.

    1. Jou (Mxyzptlk) Silver badge

      Re: The Box Of Delights

      "BBC iPlayer only works in the UK. Sorry, it’s due to rights issues." - Brexit does not let me in. Thank you Mr. "Upside-down-leek-hairdo"!

      1. Neil Barnes Silver badge

        Re: The Box Of Delights

        It doesn't let me in either, and I worked for the bloody company over thirty years!

        At least I carefully timed my exit before brexit so I maintained right-to-work and right-of-abode.

        1. CountCadaver Silver badge

          Re: The Box Of Delights

          I wish I had.... particularly on a dark Scottish winter day, I crave some Spanish or otherwise Mediterranean Sunshine......I swear like Zan on Farscape that im a plant not a mammal, I need heat and sunshine to thrive

          1. milliemoo83

            Re: The Box Of Delights

            Frell. That is all.

        2. David 132 Silver badge
          Pirate

          Re: The Box Of Delights

          I have it on my NAS. If enough people here express an interest, maybe I can figure out a way to get it to them with plausible deniability.

          Also the Bay that is skull-and-crossbonesy has it, or so I am told.

          It's a cracker, especially the theme music.

      2. Uncle Slacky Silver badge
        Stop

        Re: The Box Of Delights

        Nowt to do with Brexit, the Beeb doesn't like sharing (we had the same issues before Brexit).

        1. Dan 55 Silver badge

          Re: The Box Of Delights

          There was a directive to allow residents temporarily abroad in the EU access to their home country's streaming services in 2018, I think UK TV channels ended up bluffing it out until Brexit.

          1. Falmari Silver badge

            Re: The Box Of Delights

            The directive applied to digital content subscriptions for example Netflix and Amazon Video Prime. It did not apply to UK TV channels, BBC, ITV, Channel 4 etc because they were not paid subscription services. Free content was not covered by the directive.

            Verge

            https://www.theverge.com/2018/4/2/17187910/netflix-european-users-home-catalog-traveling

            1. Dan 55 Silver badge

              Re: The Box Of Delights

              It's debatable if BBC is free content. That aside, they made encouraging noises but in the end did nothing. The directive was optional, not obligatory, for terrestrial TV. If you paid for ITV Hub+ you could watch ITV while visiting an EU country.

              In theory there shouldn't have been any problem for rights while visiting another EU country for a short stay as the directive allowed for that.

              1. Falmari Silver badge

                Re: The Box Of Delights

                @Dan 55 "The directive was optional, not obligatory, for terrestrial TV. If you paid for ITV Hub+ you could watch ITV while visiting an EU country."

                The directive was not optional for terrestrial TV, if it was a paid digital content subscription the directive applied. That is why ITV Hub+ paid service was available while visiting the EU, the directive required ITV to do so.

                "In theory there shouldn't have been any problem for rights while visiting another EU country for a short stay as the directive allowed for that."

                Except the problem of the IPlayer registration system "is not robust enough to guarantee non-licence fee payers would be barred from watching BBC TV for free if it were to be made available in mainland Europe".

                At the end of the day the directive did not apply to the IPlayer. the BBC chose to continue to use region locking for rights management. Brexit has not locked out access to IPlayer, access was locked out before Brexit.

                Even if Brexit had not happened the BBC could still choose to continue to use region locking the directive does not apply to the IPlayer.

        2. Falmari Silver badge

          Re: The Box Of Delights

          @Uncle Slacky "(we had the same issues before Brexit)" exactly the Beeb were region locking before Brexit.

          The Beeb aren't the only ones who don't like to share. There is a lot of Non BBC content available through IPlayer, who's right holders would not want the Beeb sharing their content beyond its licensed region the UK. Those right holders would require the BBC to have implemented some form of region locking.

          1. Neil Barnes Silver badge

            Re: The Box Of Delights

            This is correct: the reason I can't see the UK streaming services (or indeed real time services, unless a satellite happens to have a bigger footprint than it should have) is entirely down to the rights holders requiring that their programming is not shown outside the originally licensed territory.

            Which is entirely the same as e.g. regional DVDs.

            For reasons I don't understand fully, but likely because the BBC is the rights holder for their broadcast radio (that didn't apply to live sports or music when I worked with iPlayer) I can get Radio 4 and the other radio channels.

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: The Box Of Delights

              Cough, cough, psst. Nord VPN works well ,,,,

              There could be more, and I’ve tried a lot of them, but so far none of the others hack it …..

              1. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: The Box Of Delights

                In a post about the BBC, shouldn't you phrase it as "Other VPN services are available."

        3. Colin Bull 1
          Unhappy

          Money speaks ....

          I am pretty sure you cannot subscribe to Sky except in UK apart from shenigans with VPNs because they greased enough palms of eurocrats.

        4. Terry 6 Silver badge

          Re: The Box Of Delights

          Not so much about liking. The BBC is cash strapped, and is required to source a lot of programmes from third parties. So it's about IP rights and sales.

      3. This post has been deleted by its author

      4. Ilgaz

        Re: The Box Of Delights

        They don't say anything like "Click here to subscribe". I would subscribe to BBC instead of Netflix.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: The Box Of Delights

      And available on the Pirate Bay forever. What's your point? Looks like a shit show.

      1. ICL1900-G3 Silver badge

        Re: The Box Of Delights

        When I was little, my mum said 'if you can't think of anything nice to say, don't say anything at all'. I expect yours did, too.

        1. David 132 Silver badge

          Re: The Box Of Delights

          Obligatory XKCD Penny Arcade...

  10. sweh

    Best present, ever

    I got my Beeb for Christmas 1983 when I was 15. When I started earning money it got a Solidisk DDFS and Solidisk 2M128 board. It traveled with me when I moved to America (with a link in the PSU set to make it 120V) and is still working just fine. It's gained a few friends (another B, a couple of Masters, econet, a Pi400 running RiscOS) but that original machine is still the one I use most.

    It probably also helped me become the geek I am today; just playing with the thing whenever I could taught me a lot. My whole career might have been different if it wasn't for that Christmas present!

  11. Boris the Cockroach Silver badge
    Windows

    Another

    day another 8 bit memory....

    But at the tail end of '84 we could see the writing on the wall as various early computer companies were starting to struggle, although a number of us were keenly awaiting the 'enterprise elan' (remember that anyone) the world's first vapourware computer (you cant count the sinclair QL as that did turn up......... eventually )

    But on a personal note... without those early 8 bit computers I would not be programming at all.... maybe mired in digital design somewhere.

    '85 was a different kettle of fish..... death in the family on my birthday! followed 5 weeks later by me in intensive care.. at that point it was febuary. (i got better)

    1. Uncle Slacky Silver badge

      Re: Another

      The Enterprise Elan did eventually come out, but most of them seem to have ended up in Hungary:

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enterprise_(computer)#History

  12. ComicalEngineer

    BBC Basic is very like Fortran 77 and as in 1987 - 89 I was working on a project developing Fortran 77 based simulation models for chemical reactors at the time I invested in a BBC Master 128. Our shared office PC cost the same as a Vauxhall Nova and we had one machine between two of us.

    I hammered the life out of the Beeb and nothing ever broke or went wrong. I even wrote my MPhil thesis on the Beeb, printed out on a Citizen 120D dot matrix printer. I particularly enjoyed the simple arcade games, DeathStar, Battle Zone, Sokoban, Galaxians, Frogger etc but especially Elite and Repton.

    I still toy with the idea of buying another BBC just for the games.

    1. David 132 Silver badge
      WTF?

      I'd love to know who downvoted your comment and their reason(s) for doing so!

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        I'd love to know who downvoted your comment and their reason(s) for doing so!

    2. Enough

      I have a BBC B and a Citizen 120D. It was a good printer, and a good price but broke down within its warranty period, it started scrambling characters. Fortunately bought it locally so I got it replaced, broke down again, with the same fault, but I had, had some use out of it, lots of college work, so not too upset. Had it hooked up to my Atari ST as well.

      Galaxians and Elite, Elite while listening to Simple Minds New Gold Dream 81/82/83/84 a sweet combo.

  13. TheMaskedMan Silver badge

    "It is not surprising that a thriving retro scene now exists to keep the aging equipment running."

    Indeed there is. Watching various YouTubers repair and refurbish 8 bit micros is one of my guilty pleasures. C64s are my favourite, since that's what I have (and still have in a box somewhere) but they're all good.

  14. nautica Silver badge
    Boffin

    Pretty good rules to live by...

    "I've come up with a set of rules that describe our reactions to technologies:

    1. Anything that is in the world when you’re born is normal and ordinary and is just a natural part of the way the world works.

    2. Anything that's invented between when you’re fifteen and thirty-five is new and exciting and revolutionary and you can probably get a career in it.

    3. Anything invented after you're thirty-five is against the natural order of things."

    ---Douglas Adams

  15. Mike Lewis

    Attack of the clones

    1986 was the year PC clones became readily available which hastened the demise of the 8 bit.

    In my case, I bought a Commodore Vic-20 in 1982 and wrote a BBS for it in 1984. It had multiple rooms (message areas), private mail and an online game. Users could start their own rooms and make them public or private. One of my users gave me my first job as a programmer, saying "Anyone who can write a BBS for a Vic can program!" Thirty years later, he wanted me to work with him at Google.

    1. Gene Cash Silver badge

      Re: Attack of the clones

      It also killed the S-100 boxen as well.

      In '84-'86 I ran a network of 3-4 CompuPro S-100 machines, each with 40mb hard drives, several serial terminals each, and a multi-user dual-CPU version of CP/M. It was probably another 5-10 years before you could do that reliably with PCs and you had to run a UNIX variant for the multi-user bit.

  16. Gene Cash Silver badge

    The video game crash of 1983

    Does anyone remember how the 6502 instruction set fit entirely on the back cover of the Atari Assembler manual?

    I got my TRS-80 on Christmas 1979, so it just passed 45 years ago.

    I went to Atari Computer Camp in 1982, which was held in the dorms of the beautiful University of North Carolina at Asheville.

    Just absolutely stunning to a kid coming from the ugly flatlands of Florida. And it still is... the Great Smokey Mountains and the Blue Ridge Parkway are worth the trip.

    Anyway, I'd written some extensions to Atari DOS, and a banner program for the Epson MX-80 which used Bresenham's line algorithm, and Dr. Alan Kay saw that and offered me a job when I graduated high school. He was Atari's Chief Scientist at the time.

    And I graduated about a month after the crash. Oh well.

    On the gripping hand, I hear video game development absolutely sucks, so I think I was actually saved from a life of drudgery and hell.

    I went to college instead, which was a much better idea.

    1. Dan 55 Silver badge

      Re: The video game crash of 1983

      There was no video game crash for the rightpondians, but a lot of publishers and developers were finished off at the end of the 8-bit age and all but a handful were finished off at the end of the 16-bit age. The margins weren't fat enough to invest in the next generation.

    2. Patrician
      Pint

      Re: The video game crash of 1983

      Have a beer for the Mote in Gods Eye reference

  17. spireite Silver badge
    Thumb Up

    History....

    When i went to the affectionally named 'Nobby Green' school (S41 Newbold area of Chesterfeild), I cut my teeth on BBC Bs and Commodore PETS. BBC used rimarily for Chuckie Egg and copious minutes of Revs and Elite.

    My first homer was a C64, andf then I graduated to mudslinging to ST owners at college when I had an Amiga 500.

    Happy days of linking by cable with friends for Stunt Car Racer, Populous et al...

    1. David 132 Silver badge
      Happy

      Re: History....

      To be fair, ST owners were degenerate subhumans deserving only of ceaseless scorn.

      Signed,

      A smug Amiga A500/1200/4000 owner.

    2. Boothy

      Re: History....

      Quote: 'S41 Newbold area of Chesterfeild[sic]'

      @ spireite : Ah, now the username makes sense :-)

      Small world! This speaking as someone who lives in Chesterfield, on Spire Heights to be exact! :-D

      PS: For anyone that doesn't get it, Chesterfields footy team are known as the Spireites, they had a new football ground built in a new location over a decade ago, and new housing was built on the old site (it was basically in the middle of a residential area), with 'Spire Heights' becoming the new name, as a homage to the old site. There is also an art 'installation' commemorating it's old use.

  18. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Well...

    This article seems to have provoked the ire of Chinnyvision.

    1. AceGrace

      Re: Well...

      I agree with ChinnyVision.

      This article is demonstrably wrong. Consoles didn't really get a foothold until the early nineties in the UK. They were seen as childrens toys, at least by myself and friends. I had an Amiga well into the nineties.

      There seems to be a lot of revisionism going on e.g. the videogames crash that didn't happen anywhere except the US.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Well...

        I fear the author was given a headline to write for and had to make his own experience fit, which made no sense for anyone outside North America.

      2. Boothy

        Re: Well...

        Completely agree, author seems to be almost a decade out.

        I had a ZX Spectrum from new (48k rubber keyboard), upgraded it to a '+' via a DIY kit (after wearing out the rubber keyboard, and I mean the actual electrical membrane, the text on the keys had long since gone!). I then moved to a +3 (floppy disk version) around 1988.

        I did switch to 16bit, with an Amiga 500, but this was a 2nd hand one, perhaps around 1990?

        I was also one of the first ones amongst my friends to move to 16bit, so at least 6 years after 1984! (Also had no interest in consoles).

        I got an Amiga 1200 (32bit) in early 1993, this time new (actually had a real job by this point!). I also picked up an Amiga 4000 2nd hand a couple of years later (a 68030, but I got hold of an 68040 board).

        Still have the Amiga 1200 and 4000, although the 500 and the Spectrum were sold long ago, back in the 90s.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Well...

      He's got a point.

      The article's author says he was there, albeit it more interested in the Box of Delights on the TV, but appears to have left out the next seven years of 8-bit dominance of the UK market... a little research of sales figures for both hardware and software would have shown that 1984 was far from the last hurrah.

      "Research," as Titus Berry in The Night Strangler says to the journalist Karl Kolchak, "that's where the joy lies. And the fascination. Let the others run scurry about gathering their contemporary bits of gossip. This is where the meat is found."

  19. deanb01

    Umm...

    I was taken on as a Spectrum and Amstrad CPC developer in the late 80s at a software house in Manchester, and was still programming games for them a couple of years later. It felt like the last hurrah around 1991 for sure, certainly not 1984.

  20. Børge Nøst

    It kinda was the last hurrah in one sense

    1984 was probably the last "innocent" Christmas where everybody expected that buying a computer was a one-and-done thing, it would carry you for years and years until the wheels fell off and when it did so you'd just move swiftly over to a new shiny one that was ofc just like the old one - know how to drive one car, know how to drive them all. And it would help you with your homework and prepare you for the future.

    By 1985 there were new generations of computers and the punters could see that there was a divide in the market, that things were changing, stuff was getting more expensive the more "bitty" it was, and the "for business" stuff was obviously nothing like the "home" stuff and much more expensive. You certainly weren't bankrolling _yet_another_ home computer that would end up with the kids playing games on it; but give it a bit of time and you _might_ come around to invest in one of those 'serious' machines you could use for work-related stuff at home. Still, there's absolutely no chance of buying a _second_ computer in the home, and if they want to play games you know that there are some that can run on the serious machine - a mate you know said he could sort some for you.

    So the old 8-bits were relegated to games machine, accepted as that, and continued to sell as such as they kept coming down and down in price, while the market for the 16-bits (IMO) was for those who had come out of the first round of home computers and found their 'mission' and were willing to prioritize money spent on those over the current pastimes of the yoofs of the day. The PC was ofc a runaway train that nobody can stop any longer, that rolled over all the others in the market.

    1. Dan 55 Silver badge

      Re: It kinda was the last hurrah in one sense

      If you already were the owner of a computer which didn't go under by 1985, you were probably unaware of anything until the late 80s-early 90s where the 16-bit compters started becoming popular and Megadrive was released at the end of 1990.

      There were lots of people who used a BBC, CPC, or PCW for business stuff through the 80s and they were all 8-bit. PCWs were sold until the late 90s.

      The PC runaway train didn't start in the home for games until 1992 or thereabouts, and only then if you had a high-end 386/486, VGA, and a Soundblaster. Still pretty pricey.

  21. madhatt3r

    Last tape I bought for CPC must have been in 1992, here's an excerpt of a Wikipedia article on Robocop:

    On home computers, the game sold over 1 million copies worldwide. It was especially successful in the United Kingdom, where it was the best-selling home computer game of the 1980s. The ZX Spectrum version in particular was the best-selling home video game of 1989. The ZX Spectrum RoboCop was one of the biggest selling games of all time on that platform and remained in the Spectrum software sales charts for over a year and a half; it entered the charts in December 1988 and was still in the top five in February 1991. It also topped the UK all-format charts for a record 36 weeks until it was knocked off the number one position by Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade in August 1989.

    Also, Prince of Persia on the CPC was an absolute marvel.

  22. CorwinX

    I'm somewhat unhappy...

    ... with you for reminding me that I'm an old git ;-)

    I was in Liverpool when it was the world centre of home computing. Worked part time at Fuller Micro. Gold stars for anyone who gets that ref.

    Amused myself a fair bit of the time cracking the various anti-piracy schemes they tried on the game tapes (not for money, just for fun).

    Simpler times.

    1. MerseyMal

      Re: I'm somewhat unhappy...

      Remember going to the shop on Sweeting Street and getting Arcadia and some sort of BASIC flight simulator when the shops opened after Christmas.

  23. nautica Silver badge
    Holmes

    "First we thought the PC was a calculator. Then we found out how to turn numbers into letters with ASCII — and we thought it was a typewriter. Then we discovered graphics, and we thought it was a television. With the World Wide Web, we've realized it's one gigantic sales brochure."

    --Douglas Adams (paraphrased}

  24. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Blunt weapon

    At our school in the late 70s, early 80s, access to the single tape drive computer was viciously controlled.

    Only the top A grade maths kids were permitted supervised access, and only at lunchtime. All others were actively discouraged or sent packing.

    Not being the top of anything, I never used it. Besides, lunchtime was for football.

    As a result, I missed the entire start and middle of computing. Odd that my career would later centre on IT.

  25. steelpillow Silver badge

    Elephants in the room

    The Amstrad PCW arrived in 1985 and blew new life into the 8-bit era. Unlike the IBM PC it was affordable, approachable and bundled with a printer. It kept the 8-bit era alive for a good few more years by pretty much creating the SOHO market for IT.

    >"However, [Acorn's] grip on UK schools loosened as parents wondered about the point of having the company's computers in classrooms while the IBM PC and its compatibles were beginning to dominate the workplace."

    Not really: a) see above, and b) Acorn faced the choice - develop the BBC Micro beyond the Master series, or swerve to an ARM architecture too expensive for the average classroom, they could not afford to do both. So they took the RISC (Sorree!), leaving the education market fractured and chaotic until secondhand obsolescent 186s got dumped wholesale on the market.

  26. Dr Kerfuffle

    Don't forget the Oric !

    I see several British brands mentioned here , but the Oric, later the Oric Atmos seem to have been omitted.

    They were important players in the 8 bit market and still have support groups running today!

    Paul

    1. Dan 55 Silver badge

      Re: Don't forget the Oric !

      If the article had mentioned the Orics, Memotech, Dragon 32, Jupiter Ace, Newbrain, and all the other evolutionary offshoots that died off and allowed the biggest players to thrive for a further five years, then that would have been right about how the 8-bit home-computing market changed in 1984.

    2. Antony Shepherd

      Re: Don't forget the Oric !

      As a Tangerine user I was always dismayed that Tangerine hadn't had the licence for the BBC Micro.

    3. Boothy

      Re: Don't forget the Oric !

      I remember my neighbour getting an Oric for Christmas in 1982 (or 83?) when I was 12/13, he was maybe 2 years younger than myself and had no real idea what to do with it! I figured it out, and ended up basically being kicked out of their house to give him a chance to use his own computer! Chuckle.

      I then pestered my parents for one relentlessly for months and months.

      The following Christmas arrived, and there was a brand new ZX Spectrum 48K and my disappointment was immeasurable, where was my Oric!!! What's this weird rubbery keyboard thing!

      This feeling lasted maybe a few minutes. Loved that machine, oh happy days.

  27. spold Silver badge

    Whippersnappers!

    What about the Commodore PET? (owned 2)

    ...or the Apple II (owned 2) which also had a Pascal compiler option and one of the first to have proper floppies (vicar)?

    or even more basic (haha) the Science of Cambridge MK14? (SCMP 8060 based, 1Mhz clock, 256 bytes memory expandable to 2K) - yes owned that one, housed it in a sandwich box and replaced the crappy pressure keyboard with microswitches, later versions did that as standard since they knew the first gen keyboard was unusable).

    Let's not forget the Apple IIe (european) with a silver case made out of recycled unemptied ashtrays, which adopted a 16:9 aspect ration which meant when you rotated a square on the screen it turned into a rectangle! (not daft enough to own one of those). (Also an ITT branded version).

    1. spold Silver badge

      Re: Whippersnappers!

      Autocorrect ratio/ration (ration was the amount of cassette tape available to store your programs if it was pre-floppy (vicar)).

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Whippersnappers!

      The story — as questionable as its claims might be — describes the end of the 8-bit home computer period, which was typified by small companies throwing together incompatible machines to sell into bedrooms with dreams of somehow capturing the zeitgeist.

      Which of your machines is relevant to "[t]he last hurrah for 8-bit home computers"?

  28. nautica Silver badge
    Pint

    Douglas Adams was one of the smartest people any of us has had the pleasure of knowing...

    "The idea that Bill Gates (one of the founders of Microsoft) has appeared like a knight in shining armour to lead all customers out of a mire of technological chaos neatly ignores the fact that it was he, by peddling second rate technology, who led them into it in the first place..."

    Douglas Adams

    1. Antony Shepherd

      Re: Douglas Adams was one of the smartest people any of us has had the pleasure of knowing...

      I always found it sad he'd not been around to see the iPad. As he was an Apple fan anyway that would have had him thrilled to bits.

  29. Einstein1960

    MSX - oh, so close...

    The author didn't mention the pre-PC phantom menace which was the MSX series. With companies like Tatung releasing a computer called the Einstein based on a common hardware specification set of options and common operating system, it was the PC which never was.

    Ahead of their time? Perhaps, but the idea that you could write a computer program which would run on multiple machines made by different manufacturers was an industry brainwave.

    Tatung were based in Telford and I remember driving there to see the official launch of the Tatung Einstein MSX.

    I worked for a software house called Anirog, who until then produced games for Commodore 64, VIC20, ZX Spectrum, BBC Micro, Amstrad mainly.

    1. madhatt3r

      Re: MSX - oh, so close...

      I had the House of Usher for the CPC, was really bad at it but damn loved the intro. :)

      1. Einstein1960

        Re: MSX - oh, so close...

        The authors of the music in House of Usher also composed the music for most or Anirog's games.

        It was a husband and wife team, as I remember.

        My voice is immortalised in Anirog Jump Jet. I did the voices for English and French versions.

  30. SPindoctor

    Early Spectrum Adoption

    I was given some money by a family friend in the summer of 84 so immediately went on the waiting list for a Spectrum. My 16k with grey rubber keys arrived in early October, just before I went away for a school trip for a week. By the time I got back, my cousin had tested it thoroughly and verified that it was knackered. So back it went for a replacement. Sinclair then screwed up & sent us 2 in return - one for cousin, one for me. Result.

    With hindsight, the 16k grey keys non-working version is now collectable & super-rare - would have been great if we'd been able to keep that. The 2 blue-grey ones are still in my Mum's loft with a selection of wobbly RAM Packs, Currah Microspeech and lots of cassette tapes. I did knock together a RetroPi setup a few years back to relive my manic miner days. Fun times.

  31. Fatnick

    Sorry this is just wrong...

    Yes, 1985 wasn't great for some people (the Dragon etc), but 1984 was hardly the end of an era. The PC wasn't really a competitor for the Amiga until the back half if the decade while as games machines even the 8-bits would persist into the 90s. When the Snes launched in the UK the charts weren't ruled by Sonic or Mario - they were ruled by Dizzy (who was still about three years in the future in Christmas 1984)

  32. GeorgePi
    Thumb Down

    Data doesn't concur

    Sales data, specifically for the Commodore 64, does not corroborate the claims of this opinion piece. It's freely available and left as an exercise for the reader to find it.

  33. mr dsb

    last hurrah 1984? the zx spectrum was the best selling computer in britain up until 1990.

    consoles came far later to mass uk appeal, did a whippersnapper write this? - or an american?

  34. Merpug

    MSX...

    The completely forgotten attempt by big Japanese tech companies to take over the home computer market, cunningly launched just at the wrong time.

    1. Einstein1960

      Re: MSX...

      MSX was originally conceived by Microsoft for the Eastern markets.

      Tatung Einstein was designed and built in UK with many being exported to Taiwan.

      Glory days...

  35. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

    That article really needed some photos!

  36. mtp

    "I bought a very second-hand BBC Micro (a partially upgraded Model A, with at least one dodgy RAM chip!) in 1989"

    I wonder if it was mine. I had one of the earliest BBC model As (I think the SN was 230 ish), I upgraded the RAM and I think the printer driver (because some things needed it despite having no printer). It also had the excellent EXMON2 ROM chip in it which I used to single step through the entire OS. Those were happy days when it was possible to know everything about how it worked.

    I sold it to a school in London sometime around 1984 and replaced it with a Atari ST 1024STFM (later replaced with a Mega 4).

  37. raiderfra

    What about Oric?

    I worked in the home computer department of a local department store during that time.

    Christmas 1984 was crazy, couldn’t keep Speccys in stock. Acorn couldn’t get the Electron out in decent numbers. The C64 was fraught with quality control, up to 75% of sales were returned due to faults.

    Loved your mention of the Dragon computers but no mention of the clever little Oric and later the Oric Atmos, a proper keyboard in a very compact size. Really deserved to do better.

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