China's homebrew Bluetooth alternative is on the march as Beijing pushes universal remotes China's Electronics Video Industry Association last week signed off on a standard for a universal remote control – a gadget Beijing thinks locals need because they're struggling with multiple remotes, but which is also a little more significant in other ways. The standard requires remote controls to allow voice control, and to …
Does this mean that it can “listen" for commands , and it is connected to WiFi, ie the Internet. ?
The article doesn't really state whether the audio leaves or enters the device.
If it can receive audio, ie it has a microphone, then some people might get the idea that 3rd parties could be involved in a way that might be a little bit questionable.
As per the article, The standard requires remote controls to allow voice control
But I am utterly convinced that it will only listen for the wake up word to comply with the user commands, and will not be listening for words and phrases that the Powers that Be consider double plus ungood. No sir!
And I am sure that the remotes will be accepting signed firmware updates via Bluetooth and er, StarFlash, from the TV, entirely for the benefit of the people of course and nothing at all to do with updating the list of woke words, sentiment analysis or anything like that!
On a possibly related note, i took apart a discarded "IVG Air" vape, and discovered what looks like a digital microphone in a 6-pin metal package (apparently used as a puff sensor, but seems a bit overkill for that purpose), QFN32 microcontroller (could be esp32, can't tell due to no part number), large anonymous SOIC8 (flash? SPI-RAM?) and a large F-shaped trace that looked suspiciously like a PCB antenna, plus the usual charge control IC and transistors. All seemed a bit more than i'd expect for a disposable vape. Maybe it doubles up as a voice control for my TV?
I'm not sure I would trust this not to be a trojan horse. Having said that, though: some competition to the crapfest that is Bluetooth had to appear eventually. If it can actually reliably find an enabled device one meter away, and it can do 2-way audio (voice+mic) at 21st century quality, and it doesn't have a different pairing procedure for every single device, it's already better than Bluetooth.
Bluetooth has taken over twenty five years to go from a naked land grab to a standard that clunkily provides so many options to ensure that none quite work together. More charitably it was conceived long before our hyper-online electronic environment, but historic excuses shouldn't prevent better alternatives from arriving on the scene.
It should be a mild embarrassment that it's the CCP that is most likely to deliver a working rival, and more of an embarrassment that the knee jerk reaction is to assume spying (I suppose mildly less xenophobic than some of the alternatives). It will be interesting to see if this penetrates western markets.
[shrug] Giving the Chinese state access to my relentlessly vanilla tastes in media consumption seems like a small price to pay for either juggling 4 remotes or relying on Logitech to continue to support an occasionally slightly wayward third party solution they don’t sell any more…
"more of an embarrassment that the knee jerk reaction is to assume spying"
My knee jerk reaction to anything that is mandated by the state - any state - is to assume that it exists for the benefit of that state, and that any apparent benefits to Joe Public are merely there to gloss over any disquiet that may arise.
In the case of China, with its very dubious track record in human rights and long history of surveillance, it's almost a no brainer.
It would be a shame if you didn't use your brain...
A more direct explanation is that, given the heavy handed restrictions on technology exports into China the CCP is naturally doing all it can to encourage local ecosystems to spring up and reduce dependence on increasingly unsympathetic foreign nations. Initiatives like this are a pretty clear way to drive local industry and skill sets.
That doesn't mean criticisms of the CCP aren't very valid, but the explanation is likely far more mundane than dystopian dreams mass surveillance through remote controls.
"A more direct explanation is that, given the heavy handed restrictions on technology exports into China "
I do not personally believe that it is the restrictions that are causing the shift. I believe that it is China's intention to initially achieve indépendance from US based technology, to produce massive amounts of technology for only Chinese/Friendly State usage, (which they actually have already started doing). They will eventually pass us by with technology and will then refuse to share/sell what they have, they want to become the dominant player in the field capable of dictating all future outcomes.
And as far as "dystopian dreams mass surveillance ", it already exists here in Europe/US, it's certainly no myth. Remind us again about what "Palantir" actually does. And one can only presume that China has similar technology that has already been pushed even further..
You've never been to China, have you? As you drive down the road there are periodic gantries making it very clear that you're being surveilled. Talking to the locals about their political system has them looking worried, even if you're being positive, because of the risk of being heard saying something 'wrong'.
Chinese state surveillance is not a dystopian dream, it's the reality for a huge proportion of the world's population.
BT was supposed to hand-off data streams to WiFi to enable fast file transfer and lossless audio. All the big tech companies praised such an upgrade then designed their own closed implementations. With clouds and tracking, of course. BT has been terminal specification ever since.
[shrug] Giving the Chinese state access to my relentlessly vanilla tastes in media consumption seems like a small price to pay for either juggling 4 remotes or relying on Logitech (and potentially supplying them with similar information) to continue to support an occasionally slightly wayward third party solution (Harmony) they don’t sell any more…
From IR remote to Bluetooth to WiFi to 5G and streaming audio, my this Star Flash has attitude!
Why the f*** would I want a handset to do all that? I mean, my smartphone already does it all, except for the IR remote bit. And it runs apps full of adware and spyware as well.
Oh, wait....
IR remotes with their simple, one-way, unencrypted, somewhat interoperable protocol are so last-century.
Besides, if you were going to say something that you didn't want the CCP knowing about, you could (for now..) unplug your telescreen and stay away from smartphones. But if even the TV remote is taking note of what you say so it can dob you in via your neighbour's TV (or yours when you next switch it on) then we might all just give up and accept surveillance by a foreign state.
As the Private Eye put it in their spoof cabinet WhatsApp group: Be careful of what you say in front of the lightbulbs
For it's (minor) faults I have been very carefully guarding my Harmony Ultimate for the last few years (it's nearly 10 years old).
Best remote I've ever had, and I was very annoyed to find out they'd stopped the entire line very quietly during the first Covid wave.
Mind you I suspect I'm a little bit of an outlier, I've got multiple disc players, the TV, sound system and HDMI switch etc all hooked up (around 7 or 8 remotes and a need to do things like "TV input 3, HDMI switch input 2, sound on, DVD on, TV on").
The truly annoying thing with remotes is that with modern phones the Harmony "hub" type device should be easy and cheap enough to make, and then an app to use on your phone as an option (which is what the Harmony hub did so you could use your phone/tablet or the supplied remote).
So....a device that looks around for WiFi, Bluetooth and 5G...
(1) ...and is helpful in controlling the local smart TV...
(2) ...has a microphone.....
(3) ...and can potentially do a million other things which the user knows nothing about....
(4) ...including being hacked from elsewhere (Cellebrite, NSO....etc)
Why on earth would I use such a thing? Apart from Slow Horses, there's nothing being streamed that I want to watch anyway!!
P.S. You can see my mobile here: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Uleway-Elderly-Unlocked-Emergency-Flashlight-Blue/dp/B09S9WT8YX
There is always this default to China are spying but what are they actually spying? We should be wary of critical infrastructure of course (we should also be wary of other countries on that) but a consumer device? What possible reason could China have for wanting to spend all the time, effort and money to track my viewing habits or listen to me in the home. Amazon already does it anyway and there are a plethora of TV remotes with built in Amazon. I'd be more worried about what Amazon is up to with my data than China. I sometimes think there is a strong hint of protectionism to these claims.
In China you don't really want be caught sparking dissent of any kind. Here is a small reminder of an event that didn't go down to well :::.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1989_Tiananmen_Square_protests_and_massacre
You do know that's an old meme about posting Tiananmen Square to get people from China disconnected from a website or conversation?
I'm not Chinese and somehow I don't think people doing propaganda from China would actually get disconnected because of it. It would be a bit naïve to think the Chinese don't know about it.
The risks of this new technology being used for spying on ordinary citizens is greatest for those in China. Like all authoritarian regimes ever, the CCP will be very keen to know what its country's citizens are doing and thinking, so that it can clamp down on any dissent quickly and early.
You know the ban on end to end encryption is exactly the same authoritarian behaviour. This isn't whataboutism I'm pointing out the hypocrisy of complaining about China when our governments want the same. The take away is that all governments are equally as bad but at least China doesn't hide it.
Maybe not you, but maybe your MP: especially of they find something that enables blackmail. Maybe people in the armed forces and their supporting businesses to track force movements and the like.
" I'd be more worried about what Amazon is up to with my data than China"
You should be worried about both. That is why I do not have any Amazon gadgets.
Well, maybe your MPs should not engage in activities that would lend themselves to blackmail!
Re: Armed Forces, when I help a top secret clearance, I was specifically instructed regarding the thinks that would get your clearance revoked! One of the most glaring didn't apply to me as I was single, but for the married folk, if they found out you were cheating on your spouse, your clearance was done!
Why this standard doesn't apply to MPs and Congressmen, seems like an oversight! It might put a stop to all that diddling with interns!
They don't care what you say at home (I don't think). But if they're able to distribute listening devices to a majority of households in China, that's spying on anti-communist citizens sorted out. If they're able to distribute in the west they'll get the opportunity to listen to civil servants, CEOs, politicians etc etc in their homes.
It's not rocket science - they're actively not on the same side as as the West.
Ignoring any of the conversation around who's spying on what, this sounds quite interesting.
If you could create something "new" to do what Bluetooth does now, and could jettison a bunch of legacy backwards compatibility, you might have a fighting chance of creating something a bit more reliable.
Presumably this sits on 2.4GHz?
Can we assume it's less onerous from a patents/licensing perspective?
its all made up crap that will never see the light of day. Bejings "ultra GPU" was claimed to be world-class. Then turned out to be slower than a GeForce 480ti in actual workloads/gaming etc.
China has previously claimed to have super-mega wifi that runs with less than 5ns (NANO not micro) latency, and throughput in the terabytes/second.
At this point they might as well claim to have Galaxy-class starships, transporters, replicators and a smartphone that can literally facetime Jesus himself.
Except that they all want to be the one in between the consumer and their media choices. That's why you see remotes with Netflix, Hulu etc. buttons because they're being paid by Netflix, and compatibility between remotes typically only works with IR - using a 30 year old standard where you have to randomly type in codes for a manufacturer until you hit the right one. And even then it only supports a bare minimum of functionality.
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