User talk:Crowsus

Category:People from Basel-Stadt

Hello. Regarding these recent edits of ours[1], maybe I'm missing something, but Basel-Stadt is not a city, it is a Canton of Switzerland, is it not? Therefore Category:People from Basel-Stadt doesn't belong in Category:People by city in Switzerland any more than Category:People from California belongs in Category:People by city in the United States. It's in Category:People by state in the United States just like Category:People from Basel-Stadt should be in Category:People by canton in Switzerland — which in fact it is — it shouldn't be in both canton and city categories is the point. --DB1729^talk 05:39, 8 September 2022 (UTC)

Hi @DB1729:, it's a city-region, everything outside the urban area belongs to Basel-Landschaft. This is the only instance in Switzerland as far as I know, but Berlin and Hamburg are examples in Germany. The American examples you gave are false equivalences, the only near equivalent would be Washington DC (fully aware its not a state, but it is a geopolitical entity which only contains a city). If you want, I'm happy to create a separate set of categories for Basel the city within Basel-Stadt the canton, but it seems a bit unnecessary to me. Crowsus (talk) 07:06, 8 September 2022 (UTC)

I didn't read past the lead where it says "It is composed of three municipalities with Basel as the capital" which didn't remind me of Berlin, Hamburg or DC. Not sure what an equivalent example a "half-canton" would be. Don't worry about creating separate categories if you don't think it's needed. DB1729^talk 11:10, 8 September 2022 (UTC)

Category:S.L. Benfica non-playing staff

What's your criteria for adding people to Category:S.L. Benfica non-playing staff? I have been adding assistant coaches, and I don't recall Bruno Lage and Renato Paiva being assistants at Benfica. SLBedit (talk) 14:06, 12 September 2022 (UTC)

Hi @SLBedit:, they coached the youth teams. Crowsus (talk) 14:41, 12 September 2022 (UTC)

Okay, but they also coached the main teams (first and B), so I don't see the purpose of putting them in the category. SLBedit (talk) 14:50, 12 September 2022 (UTC)

Possible misplaced categories

I see you have added new categories for some pages in my watchlist. For instance, you added the categories Comarques of the Province of Lleida and Pyrenees in the page Pallars Sobirà. However, that page is already in the category Pallars Sobirà. Doesn't make it more sense to add those new cats in the category Pallars Sobirà, rather than in the page Pallars Sobirà? The same thing happens with other pages. Best regards. Jotamar (talk) 21:48, 21 September 2022 (UTC)

Hi @Jotamar:. In terms of Comarques of the Province of Lleida, that should definitely be in the Pallars Sobirà article and all others in Lleida, because being a comarque of the province is its primary topic. A reader looking for this topic would expect to find the articles on each place, and not just the categories concerning them. To give a vague equivalent for Spain, the article for Madrid has the Municipalities in the Community of Madrid and Capitals of Europe categories, although both of those are also in the Madrid topic category. Crowsus (talk) 00:05, 22 September 2022 (UTC)

Sabin Merino

Hiya, all well? Hopefully so (it's me, your fellow Athletic fan from that country next to Spain)! Great job from "our" goalkeeper yesterday, fortunately :)

Can you find the correct number of Basque caps for this chap please? Certainly does not have two in one year (that or the date was not updated)...

Keep it up, kind regards 193.137.135.5 (talk) 12:25, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

@193.137.135.5: hi there, hope you're well too, your usual hard work in the background has not gone unnoticed (even tho you've retired of course). Sabin does actually have 2 caps from that year, there was a end-of-season match against Corsica and the usual winter fixture against Tunisia. There were also 2 in 2007 (Venezuela and Catalonia) and 2011 (Estonia and Tunisia) and 3 back in 2006 (Serbia, Wales, Catalonia) but definitely not common, and scanning over this list, there seems to be only one other player that got 2 caps which both fell in the same calendar year - Joseba Zaldua played in those same games. Crowsus (talk) 16:22, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

Gotcha! Okeydokey, i honestly thought they only played once come Christmas time, always learning :) Thanks for the info. --2001:8A0:767B:9C00:1513:52EB:FDB2:3FBD (talk) 20:22, 28 September 2022 (UTC)

"Sportsmen"?

Hi there. I just saw this change. What is the rationale for differentiating by gender here? Robby.is.on (talk) 18:40, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

@Robby.is.on:, hi, not sure to be honest, I had nothing to do with its creation, the tree seems to date from 2014 and only be for States of Australia. Some of the States have had a category since about that time, but strangely the one you are referring to for Victoria, one of the most populous states of course, was seemingly only created in 2020. This seems to be a complete outlier in terms of categorisation, and were it nominated for deletion and upmerging back to Sportspeople, I would have no objection and would support it. However, I'm not going to do any nominating myself because I can't be bothered doing all the setting up for CfD, and while the intersection is there, it makes sense to divide the Sportspeople into Sportsmen and Sportswomen for each state - I guess any Trans folk would remain in Sportspeople, but haven't come across any of them as far as I know. It would be pretty easy to restore them all back to Sportspeople again in the likely event of a successful CfD. Cheers, Crowsus (talk) 18:57, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

Ah, that's curious. I understand that you don't feel like CfDing. It's a process I am not familiar with and I don't want to learn that now… Robby.is.on (talk) 19:08, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

councils in melbourne/victoria

oops - the diffs might not even relate to your edits in the first place,

apologies...

victoria is the parent cat, so to speak, and melbourne is the child,

hope that is enough explanation...

thank you very much for doing things - the melbourne/victoria subject

area is sorely in need of maintenance and rejigging - so thanks! JarrahTree 10:52, 5 October 2022 (UTC)

@JarrahTree: Hi, no it's fine, the edits probably were me, was doubting whether to put them in Victoria and Melbourne as some are quite far out of the city. My opinion would be that the suburbs should stay in both the general Melbourne list and in the LGAs as its good to see a complete 'collection' and readers might not be sure in which LGA(s) they would be found, but if you think differently I'll happily defer, there is already the list article too.

I just stumbled across Melbourne stuff the other day and was quite surprised to see so little in the way of subcategories for a city of this size (in contrast to the articles themselves which are generally good quality IMO), I have a feeling the LGAs don't matter to a lot of local residents (not sure if you are one) but they definitely have some significance having been in that arrangement for close to 30 years, and nothing else admin-wise between state and suburb. The longstanding suburbs and towns (their names were about the only thing I knew about the city, from the AFL teams) will matter more to residents in some cases and I see there are a few of those, but they can generally fit neatly into the LGA trees, it's a bit too much 'local knowledge' for me to create much new at that level, populating the ~30 LGAs is proving quite enough without delving into the nuances of 400 suburbs. Please let me know if you spot I'm doing it wrong! Crowsus (talk) 12:54, 5 October 2022 (UTC)

Nah, anything is good - big problem is the drop off of editors who have interest in maintaining the areas that you are touching on - and I have no attachment to the larger Melbourne apart from disbelief of the neglect of material sadly in need of maintenance. My places of residence, were and are elsewhere... JarrahTree 13:17, 5 October 2022 (UTC)

Sorry, but some of the categorisations are puzzling. For example, in all the literature I've come across on Tom Roberts and Arthur Streeton, I can't recall any significant connection to Richmond. Appreciate the effort but personally I would be hesitant to overhaul a foreign city in this manner. Edit: Streeton was raised for a time in Richmond, my bad. - HappyWaldo (talk) 00:46, 12 October 2022 (UTC)

@HappyWaldo: my mistake sorry, there were some from Richmond who I changed but Roberts lived in Collingwood (which does not have its own category at present but has enough people for one, that would remove the anachronistic impression of seeing Yarra). Crowsus (talk) 08:26, 12 October 2022 (UTC)

A cookie for you!

Ulises12345678 (talk) 17:45, 9 October 2022 (UTC)

Scottish districts

I have produced a list of Scottish districts at User:Crouch, Swale/Scottish districts for both 1975 and 1996 districts. Similar to the fact you created Glasgow (district) because the boundaries were changed in 1996 and merged Clackmannan (district) because the boundaries didn't change in 1996. Its indeed standard to not have separate articles if boundaries didn't change in a reform, see WP:UKDISTRICTS. Those that are marked with "no separate article" like Argyll and Bute (district) could be created if though necessary but it may not be worth having separate articles for many as the changes were often not significant. The one I'm not sure about is Kyle and Carrick/South Ayrshire as the order says South Ayrshire was formed from just Kyle and Carrick meaning it should be merged but the articles say (which is cited) that Dalmellington was moved to East Ayrshire suggesting we should keep separate articles. File:Kyle and Carrick.svg and File:South Ayrshire in Scotland.svg do show different areas. Crouch, Swale (talk) 20:44, 15 October 2022 (UTC)

City of Darebin cat

G'day Crowsus. Just curious as to why you've categorised Don Chipp as "from the City of Darebin", which didn't exist at the time of his birth or anytime during his significant career. Where's your verification of the claim? Bjenks (talk) 07:10, 17 October 2022 (UTC) @Bjenks: "Don Chipp was born in Melbourne and educated at Northcote Primary School, Northcote High School" so pretty likely he lived in that area, nobody has bothered to create a category for Northcote so Darebin is the closest thing. Remove it if you like. Crowsus (talk) 11:45, 17 October 2022 (UTC)

England Census

I saw you add those England Census refs to Charles F. Simmons (footballer), and I wonder if you could do the same with Jaaames Reeeves (footballer). Thank you. Barr Theo (talk) 18:20, 2 November 2022 (UTC)

Percival Serle

Re your recent amendment to P Serle, what is the significance of the "Glen Eira" reference? Serle was born in New St at the house owned by W K Thompson, partner in James McEwan and Co, which as I understand it is not in Glen Eira as it was. Secondly, he spent less than a year there as an infant, moving to East Melbourne (Powlett St), where the Serles lived for about 16 years before his father built in Hawthorn. Serle indeed spent much of his life at "Asolo", Church St Hawthorn, which he purchased in 1915. I suggest you delete the Glen Eira reference.Lexysexy (talk) 06:22, 8 November 2022 (UTC)

@Lexysexy: Hi, well, I thank you for giving me the option to delete rather than just going ahead yourself, I have no objection at all with it being removed, although I have to say, almost none of the details you wrote just now are in the article as it stands, only that he was born at Elsternwick. My intention is to add categories for all the suburbs that would have enough entries to justify their creation, that would reduce the anachronism of using modern geography terms like Glen Eira. As for Serle, clearly you have specific knowledge and interest so whatever you want to include or not is fine, I don't have the time or inclination to go through the nuances of every article, just trying to improve the categorisation of the city as a whole, across all topics, based on a few seconds of scanning what is in the body of the text, so inevitably there will be a few judgement calls that I get wrong. But, for example, East Melbourne isn't mentioned at all and Hawthorn only as a place of death so I'm not sure how I or anyone else is meant to know that in his life arc. So I respectfully suggest that you maybe add that in too if you have the time and sources. Crowsus (talk) 07:36, 8 November 2022 (UTC)

Hello Crowsus. I choose this route to avoid the plague of edit-warring. I will, in due course, add some of this personal detail to the Serle article - I have the necessary references.Lexysexy (talk) 21:15, 8 November 2022 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1912 disestablishments in Italy

A tag has been placed on Category:1912 disestablishments in Italy indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Cardiff Arms Park

You have previously edited Cardiff Arms Park. An editor has decided to split the article (yet again). I would like to know your view on the new edit....see Talk:Cardiff_Arms_Park#Article_Split_(again). SethWhales ^talk 20:24, 13 November 2022 (UTC)

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Mikel Merino

If this is not the clearest case of WP:CIR, then i don't know the first thing about WP rules: 15 December 2022, user adds (as habitually! They also invent titles of sources and translates them using Google T! Another good example would be Javi Navarro (footballer, born 1974), played no games in a specific season for Valencia CF due to a serious injury, they go on a rant saying how he joined his teammates and received his medal for the 1999 Copa del Rey Final using...his Footballdatabase.eu profile as source!) ref for his initial problems/injuries at Real Sociedad, using a website (Fichajes.com) with a newspiece from BEFORE the start of the season (he had just signed for club)! I browsed and browsed the web for a ref for his 32 games/4 goals, but came out empty and gave up :(

Happy Christmas to you and yours, keep safe (16 years, dunno what i'm still doing here, but i'll hang on i guess)! 193.137.135.5 (talk) 14:07, 20 December 2022 (UTC)

• Found ref for that season totals, cheers! --193.137.135.5 (talk) 14:22, 20 December 2022 (UTC)

@193.137.135.5: Hi, yeah its clearly bad form to claim he struggled, and re-name a ref to support that narrative when it's not the correct content - and I don't recall him struggling much when he joined anyway, why would someone from 100km away have trouble 'adapting'? I will try to keep an eye out for them and other problem edits/editors, well done to you for spotting so many that might otherwise go un-noticed. All the best for the season and new year. Crowsus (talk) 14:53, 21 December 2022 (UTC)

William Lindsay (Scottish footballer) moved to draftspace

An article you recently created, William Lindsay (Scottish footballer), is not suitable as written to remain published. It needs more in-depth coverage about the subject itself, with citations from reliable, independent sources in order to show it meets WP:GNG. It should have at least three. And please remember that interviews, as primary sources, do not count towards GNG.(?) Information that can't be referenced should be removed (verifiability is of central importance on Wikipedia). I've moved your draft to draftspace (with a prefix of "Draft:" before the article title) where you can incubate the article with minimal disruption. When you feel the article meets Wikipedia's general notability guideline and thus is ready for mainspace, please click on the "Submit your draft for review!" button at the top of the page.Onel5969 ^{TT me} 12:59, 25 December 2022 (UTC)

That's nice; I've restored this unilateral action. Feel free to take it to AfD instead. Crowsus (talk) 15:27, 25 December 2022 (UTC)

9 January 2022 on European Cup 1956-57 edit and unsense delete

For the first, this is not Rapid Wien, but Rapid JC - the team from the Netherlands and the list is not uncorrect. For the second, what is "unformatted"? For the third a) the list is currently unsourced, but this can change in the next time b) this is in the current and previous article and logical c) this is important Metufit (talk) 13:28, 1 January 2023 (UTC)

FFS, nearly a full year ago. Unformatted means you couldn't be bothered to create links for the teams. Unsourced means you added the list without providing any source. Crowsus (talk) 14:59, 1 January 2023 (UTC)

Happy New Year, Crowsus!

Happy New Year!

Crowsus,
Have a prosperous, productive and enjoyable New Year, and thanks for your contributions to Wikipedia.
— Moops ^⋠T⋡ 00:25, 2 January 2023 (UTC)

   Send New Year cheer by adding {{subst:Happy New Year fireworks}} to user talk pages.

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Category:South Australian politicians

Hi Crowsus, this and similar categories shouldn't be used if the subject is already in a subcategory, such as Category:Federal politicians from South Australia. Thanks. ITBF (talk) 01:05, 11 January 2023 (UTC)

@ITBF: hi, thanks for your message. The categories seem a bit mixed up, the 'Federal politicians' subcat has representatives for all the constituencies regardless of their personal origin, which may well not be SA. It should probably be titled Federal politicians in/of South Australia, or match some of the other states i.e South Australia federal politicians. The location of the politician's office should be a separate branch from that of their personal origin so ideally there should be a category for South Australians who were politicians regardless of where they were elected, although I realise the vast majority for SA will be from Adelaide, which has a category in this regard, so not a massive deal. Crowsus (talk) 09:10, 11 January 2023 (UTC)

User:Carlinv...

...and their WP:CIR: section/wording about Mikel Merino's Copa del Rey is already well sourced (with mentions to pandemic as well), they go an add another ref, from the The Guardian. Name of news article is "Real Sociedad beat Athletic to claim Copa del Rey and Basque glory", they name it "Mikel Merino won his first Copa del Rey"... Getting REALLY tiresome!

Have a nice week, regards RevampedEditor (talk) 17:46, 15 January 2023 (UTC)

• More, at Pablo Alfaro: apparently, Spanish refs are now in English, and now you spot the differences in titles: One ref is titled "Pablo Alfaro: "It was tough to leave Sevilla"", for this guy it's "Pablo Alfaro leaves Sevilla F.C. for Racing Club"; another one "Pablo Alfaro will be one of the Cantabrian additions", they name it "Pablo Alfaro is the new Racing signing"; the third one, which i reverted because his personal life was already properly sourced with TWO, changed from "Pablo Alfaro" to "Pablo Alfaro has the medicine degree"!

Apparently, no one paying attention to this but me, and i'm getting tired... --RevampedEditor (talk) 00:59, 17 January 2023 (UTC)

Disruptive editing

Please do not remove Norwegian footballers from the Norwegian footballers category. In the past, I have wrongfully done this exact same behavior, and I was warned by an administrator that if I do it again I will be banned. I feel it is fair to you that I warn you before I have to report your disruptive editing. I would appreciate it if you put the edits back, because reverting your disruptive edits took me forever. Please do not engage in edit warring. That is also a bannable offense unfortunately. Thank you. Helpfulwikieditoryay (talk) 10:22, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

''Fooian women's footballers'' is the base category, with the whole list a subcategory of ''Fooian footballers''. Not sure where you are getting the idea it's anything else. Thanks for the warning, but I'm in the right. Crowsus (talk) 10:25, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

I have already spoken to administrators about this. Some categories only allow subcategories, because the scope is so large. Norwegian footballers is NOT one of them. The category Norwegian footballers is a list of names. Then you can go further to see subcategories separated by the footballers' age, gender, international status, etc. There are 2,196 names currently under the Norwegian footballers category. You have taken care to only remove my edits and leave the other 2,196 alone. The names that I have added to that list belong there. Again, I've done the same thing as you in the past by mistake, and I was threatened with a ban. We don't need to fight. You need to top preventing a list of 2,196 Norwegian footballers from becoming 2,300 Norwegian footballers. Helpfulwikieditoryay (talk) 10:37, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

Link me to your chat with the administrators. There are 200 categories for Women's footballers and none of them also have the Footballers category on each article. Even for the Danish list, only 50 of the 178 articles had the 'double cat'. So either 120 were wrong, or 50 were wrong. Crowsus (talk) 10:42, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

It is on my talk page. I tried correcting that problem, but you reverted it! Why are you reverting it just because it wasn't that way before? That is the point of being able to edit an article at any time, the previous version is not always correct. Explain why you are reverting without just saying "It used to be that way before." That makes no sense. Being in two similar categories is correct when it's non-diffusing for GENDER. That has always been the rule on wikipedia. For example, a Norwegian painter and a Norwegian women's painter are two categories and the painter has BOTH of them on their page. Footballers are not magically different. This is the universal rule on wikipedia. Adding a gender does NOT make the normal category wrong. 50 were correct. 120 were simply neutral by not having it there, but also not saying it shouldn't be there. I am trying to help the other slacking 120 pages go up to the level of the other 50, which are properly categorized. Helpfulwikieditoryay (talk) 10:54, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

Women's sport is different because they are split by gender. A female painter is a painter, but a female footballer is a player of women's football. I have looked at your talk page, it mostly consists of you being politely corrected having made up your own (well-intentioned) rules for things that go against consensus. By the way, I have also found (having had similar arguments) that categorisation norms differ between topics and even between sports in that genre. So unless you can show me some discussion on this specific topic where your idea that all women's footballer/sportspeople articles should be in a nationality category AND a gendered nationality category, I'm going to assume it's just something you have decided to pursue unilaterally when the convention is clearly the opposite. No big deal, I do things like that too, but when someone challenges it, the changer need to demonstrate that there's been some effort to consult others and get agreement. And just to confirm, it is you who is the changer here. Crowsus (talk) 11:07, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

I've had a lot of experience listening to other people's opinions and learning. In the past I would have agreed with you, but I was politely corrected by admins and editors multiple times on this exact topic. You are against consensus. A woman who plays football in Norway is a Norwegian footballer. That's the correct category, and removing her from that is disruptive editing. You not only removed my edits, you removed hundreds of other people's. Please do not make a personal attack. She is a Norwegian footballer. She is also a Norwegian women's footballer. If I attempted to put her in the category for Norwegian men's footballers, it would be wrong because sport is separated by gender and she is not a man. But I simply put her in the category for Norwegian footballers. Are you claiming Norwegian women's footballers are not footballers in Norway? This is getting ridiculous. For example, Asbjørn Aamodt is in the Norwegian footballers category. He is also in the Norway international footballers category. This is a non-diffusing category. If women's football was somehow not football(?), it would not be a subcategory under the football category... Merely being a category under the Norwegian footballers category shows that women's footballers belong in the long list of Norwegian footballers. Helpfulwikieditoryay (talk) 11:17, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

Look, I'll make it easy for you. Go to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Football and state your case that you believe all the women's footballer articles should have the base category and the gendered category. There are plenty of folk on there so you should get a quick reply. I expect most, if not all will be similar answers that I have given, but if they agree with you, great. That then becomes the consensus, and I would be happy to help to apply that consensus, I have a tool that can add it to each nationality with minimal effort. You could also try Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Women's sport as that relates to the overarching idea that women's sport category trees should be separate - although I'm not sure how many editors are active there. Feel free to tag me and link to this discussion(s) - or not, if you don't want this chat to influence that one. Crowsus (talk) 11:29, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

I'm not familiar enough with wiki yet to know how to do that. I have trouble even posting on the tea house. Of course the women's sports category is separate from the men's. Absolutely no one is arguing that. I am simply saying Norwegian women's footballers (which is a category under Norwegian footballers...) ARE Norwegian footballers. They DO NOT belong in the men's category. They simply belong in the Norwegian footballers category. The only reason I'm even doing this is because I personally had difficulty using wikipedia as a tool to find footballers when there's a category for "general" Norwegian footballers that doesn't even include the women, but then there's a women's category and no men's category. It's just utterly confusing. This is a bad format that should be changed asap. The common sense thing to do would be to have the Norwegian footballers category for... Norwegian footballers. Then have non-diffusing subcategories for men, women, youth, international, expatriate, or whatever else they need. I'm really sorry for arguing so much. This is just exhausting after I spent hours and days trying to make the pages a little less off-putting to navigate, and then it just gets reverted within a second. There can't be a Norwegian footballers category if Norwegian footballers aren't even allowed in that category. It is clearly easier navigation for sports articles to be done like every other subject on wikipedia, with a non-diffusing men and women's category. I was going to try to add a men's category, but that is a daunting task since I don't have a tool to do mass edits. Do you agree with this? Do you think this a project you could help me with? Helpfulwikieditoryay (talk) 11:43, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

There have been recent discussions at [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Football/Archive_152] and [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Football/Archive_155] (search for "men's") to bring it up. There is support for the concept of adding men's categories rather than them just being the assumed default, but implementing it has stalled due to the technical aspects and the vast amount of articles that would be involved. I can confirm that other women's sports follow the diffusing model, so I will ask there about the reasoning behind it. Crowsus (talk) 12:47, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

It sounds like the consensus is to categorize male and female footballers the same way, but just that nobody has completed it in its entirety yet because it's a large task? I was trying to contribute task by hand, but that got reverted, so now I'm confused. We should start the task now, at least work on it little by little, not just put it off forever and leave wikipedia unfinished because it's time-consuming. I don't see the need to make a new discussion thread about the topic (I also don't really know how) when there has already been consensus saying we should categorize male and female footballers the same way. Should we just resume the task? For example, there is already a category Swiss men's footballers. Swiss women's footballers are already named in the Swiss footballers category. There should be a Norwegian (and every other country) men's footballers list as well. Why not add Norwegian women's footballers to the Norwegian footballers list like I did? I was just continuing what was already started. In fact I didn't even start doing that until I saw someone else add "Danish footballers" on an article of a woman I created. I only had Danish women's footballers, then someone edited my article and added Danish footballers, so I followed suit with the rest of the articles I created, and looked for similar ones. Do we need to start a new discussion or can we just start the work? Helpfulwikieditoryay (talk) 02:03, 20 January 2023 (UTC)

Contributing to a project page is just the same as to an individual page. Hopefully you got the notification at the Women's Sport project re my request for clarification on why it is gendered at the highest level. As things stand, we can create the men's footballer categories, but it would still be the same pattern as other sports: there would be Fooian men's footballers or Fooian women's footballers on each article, but not Fooian footballers. Crowsus (talk) 09:16, 20 January 2023 (UTC)

I didn't see the notication but I just looked it up now. Thanks. Do you think it would be easiest to convert the Norwegian footballers category to be Norwegian men's footballers (if that is possible?) so we don't have to erase thousands of men from the Norwegian footballers category? I agree with you that sports should be split by gender more than painting, for example. (However that may get confusing for women who played on men's club teams... So it is split by the person's gender, not the "gender of the sport" they played.) But what I'm saying is having a Norwegian footballers category that has men and not women is NOT splitting it by gender. That's ungendered, and then split into a subcategory? That's super weird and makes no sense. I think we're on the same page now (sorry for arguing earlier), so how do we start this project? Helpfulwikieditoryay (talk) 10:13, 20 January 2023 (UTC)

Never mind that for now, I see you've been adding Expatriate footballers on top of articles with Expatriate women's footballers. This is clearly overcategorisation. It doesn't come under the scope of 'should it be a national+gender+occupation', it is an additional, separate category tree. The women's category is clearly a subcat of the main category - as above, for equality there should probably be a men's category for each country, but what is not in doubt is that only either the women's category or the men's (currently the parent) is required. Crowsus (talk) 22:47, 20 January 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for moving Danish footballers! I'll start doing that for other countries. I agree there's no need for someone to be under expatriate footballers and expatriate women's footballers because it's excessive. The problem is just that women are not a type of man, so a women's category can't be inside the men's category for any subject. Thank you for fixing that category as well. Helpfulwikieditoryay (talk) 03:34, 22 January 2023 (UTC)

Crowsus I don't think your edits are necessarily disruptive, but where is the consensus for these mass changes that will affect literally hundreds of thousands of article? GiantSnowman 10:28, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

That would be at Wikipedia:Village pump (proposals)/Archive 188#RfC: Categorise male footballers in the same way that we categorise female footballers. Crowsus (talk) 11:51, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

That's the one. The RFC is nearly a year old, never implemented, and the closer said that "There is consensus in favor of both the main proposal and the subproposal. However, these options are contradictory". In any event, did you not think to discuss the logistics of this (such as by getting a bot to do it?) rather than diving into it and flooding watchlists with changes? GiantSnowman 11:55, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

Um, that's only half the sentence, the whole of which is "However, these options are contradictory, meaning that the main proposal overrides the subproposal's consensus due to wider participation." So it has consensus. The logistics were discussed here but nobody bothered to do anything beyond Gunnar Larsen's semi-serious efforts with Switzerland, discussed here. You and I both commented on that, yes CfD was proposed there, but again months down the line nobody had made any move to implement and now we have Helpfulwikieditoryay manually double-categorising women's articles to make a point, but accusing me of disruptive editing when I am following the current conventions by fixing them. I could see CfD being a long and annoying process, because it always is, potentially with problems at the top level if you're re-naming Fooian footballers to Fooian men's footballers but still need a 'new' Fooian footballers above that as container for the Men's and Women's lists (and things that don't need split). Denmark is one of the countries Helpfulwikieditoryay was most interested in, so I have started there, basically finished now. There may well be issues to iron out before this format can be taken forward to other countries, but this way at least the categories are there to be populated (or deleted) rather than everyone ignoring it or waiting for someone else to do it. A bot will still be quicker for the bigger countries, but starting it manually should make more editors aware of the situation if they weren't paying attention - the more obvious the better IMO, and if anyone wants to spit the dummy about the whole thing they will get the opportunity to put their point in, although they'd probably have missed the boat there. Crowsus (talk) 13:01, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Nigerian expatriate basketball people in in Portugal

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Victorian Heritage Register Barwon South West

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:British emigrants to the Turks and Caicos Islands

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:English expatriate sportspeople in Kosovo

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Category:West German expatriate sportspeople in Ghana has been nominated for deletion

Category:West German expatriate sportspeople in Ghana has been nominated for deletion. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Pbritti (talk) 22:11, 30 January 2023 (UTC)

You need to pause your category creation ASAP. There are a few issues that need to be discussed and many of your new categories appear frivolous. ~ Pbritti (talk) 22:15, 30 January 2023 (UTC)

Nah thanks anyway but I'll create them as I please, as they are valid in my opinion, and they can be discussed in due course. Crowsus (talk) 22:17, 30 January 2023 (UTC)

You've made about a dozen categories solely containing one man who matched the contents of most of those categories for less than a year. These categories serve no real purpose. You should stop. ~ Pbritti (talk) 22:35, 30 January 2023 (UTC)

At the very least, Crowsus, you need to stop edit-warring over which categories articles should go into. Continuing with this activity can lead to a loss of editing privileges. Please discuss categorization on the article talk page and do not just undo or revert another editor's changes. I know that it takes at least two editors to edit-war but this message is directed at you. Thank you. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:45, 30 January 2023 (UTC)

Hi Liz, what changes are you referring to in that context? Crowsus (talk) 23:10, 30 January 2023 (UTC)

I'm blanking on the category I was looking at yesterday where this was happening. But you and another editor kept moving articles in and out of a category. It made a big enough impression on me that I came to your talk page to leave you a note but not enough that I remember the specific category in question. If I remember, I'll let you know.

Also, please do not remove CSD tags from pages you have created. If a category is no longer empty, another editor can untag the page. Thank you. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 17:35, 31 January 2023 (UTC)

OK, think I know the one you're talking about. Part of the thing was that we were both using cat a lot and not watching the page (at least I wasn't) so it was a kinda indirect thing bouncing between us. To end that impasse, I did do a manual edit with a summary explaining my reasoning and the holes in theirs, but I take your point. Sorry about the untagging, wasn't aware of the protocol there, I thought I was helping by taking it out of the 'list'. Crowsus (talk) 17:41, 31 January 2023 (UTC)

Per the outcome of community discussion, please see my initial comment. ~ Pbritti (talk) 23:05, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Australian expatriate sportspeople in Cambodia

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Israeli expatriate ice hockey people in the United Kingdom

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Swedish expatriate ice hockey players in Wales

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Buildings and structures in the City of Kingston (Victoria)

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:City of Kingston (Victoria)

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:People from the City of Kingston (Victoria)

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Railway stations in the City of Kingston (Victoria)

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Sport in the City of Kingston (Victoria)

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Suburbs of the City of Kingston (Victoria)

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Transport in the City of Kingston (Victoria)

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Israeli expatriate ice hockey players

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:West German expatriates in China

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:West German expatriates in Ghana

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:West German expatriates in Japan

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:West German expatriates in Tonga

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Swedish expatriate ice hockey people in the United Kingdom

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Austrian expatriates in Montenegro

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Connor McDavid

Hello Crowsus - so you've adding Connor to the Canadian_expatriate_ice_hockey_players_in_the_United_States category based on his 3 years in the OHA playing in Erie PA, is that correct? If so, that's ridiculous. We will see what our colleagues think about it. PKT(alk) 02:54, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

If you have evidence that he was based in Canada for those 3 years and made the 250-mile round trip for every Erie game, fair enough. Maybe the whole team does the commute, you will know better than me how it works at that level. Crowsus (talk) 03:05, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Expatriate sportspeople from Georgia (country) in South Korea

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Expatriates from Georgia (country) in South Korea

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Georgia (country)–South Korea relations

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Expatriate footballers in Montserrat

A tag has been placed on Category:Expatriate footballers in Montserrat indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Senegalese expatriate sportspeople in Montserrat

A tag has been placed on Category:Senegalese expatriate sportspeople in Montserrat indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:35, 2 March 2023 (UTC)

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New message from 寒吉

Hello, Crowsus. You have new messages at Wikipedia:Teahouse.
Message added 07:16, 23 March 2023 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

寒吉 (talk) 07:16, 23 March 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for creating Jakub Brabenec!

As someone who's created/updated a bunch of VGK prospect articles, thanks for putting in the effort to create and detail Brabenec's; it looks great! I've since added stats and I'll add his honors/awards table later. The Kip (talk) 17:49, 28 March 2023 (UTC)

Thanks! Crowsus (talk) 16:01, 5 April 2023 (UTC)

Miguel Fuentes (Spanish footballer)

Hiya!

Do you agree with this page move? I don't, and this user has the custom of doing this, pulling these undiscussed page moves from his wiki-hat and it's getting to be really annoying.

Spanish people (and Portuguese ones, i guess) are occasionally known by two first names (i.e. "Miguel Ángel" in Spain, "João Pedro" in Portugal) i suppose that, following that "logic", José Antonio Reyes should be moved to "José Reyes"!

Take care, enjoy the rest of that weekend RevampedEditor (talk) 13:04, 1 April 2023 (UTC)

I agree, and I've put it back. However, looking at the refs, most of them do seem to refer to him as just Miguel so that may be sufficiently strong argument to change it once again. But it merits discussion, as should have been done the first time around... Crowsus (talk) 14:04, 1 April 2023 (UTC)

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A barnstar for you! :D

	The Categorisation Barnstar
	For your work categorizing articles. Your efforts do not go unnoticed! — Ixtal ( T / C ) ⁂ Non nobis solum. 12:49, 5 April 2023 (UTC)

Thanks! Crowsus (talk) 16:01, 5 April 2023 (UTC)

Your recent contributions to 1993 Copa del Rey final

You may be blocked from editing without further warning the next time you vandalize Wikipedia, as you did at 1993 Copa del Rey final. Not welcome at da SD (talk) 18:57, 6 April 2023 (UTC)

Umm, OK >D Crowsus (talk) 19:00, 6 April 2023 (UTC)

Davide Massa

Can you rewrite the page of Davide Massa, mainly about chaos in Juventus vs Inter Coppa Italia natch? 2A02:C7C:5ADE:9E00:2452:EECA:FCA8:1050 (talk) 22:32, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

Category copying

Hello. I noticed, on an obscure cricketer, that you'd copied some people from the Category: People from Streatham to the Category: Sportspeople from the London Borough of Lambeth. This may be reasonable in some cases, but not all. I live (no spoilers) in Streatham; but I'm in the London Borough of Wandsworth, not Lambeth. Some farflung bits of Streatham are in Croydon too. London geography isn't simple. Johnlp (talk) 12:48, 17 April 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Johnlp:, sorry about that, and thanks for pointing it out, I had not spotted it with Streatham but I did for Highgate. What I did there, and will now do for Streatham, is create a Sportspeople cat just for the suburb, so it will appear in 3 lists but not be incorrect on individual pages. Crowsus (talk) 15:03, 17 April 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for doing that. Many of the old London-area boundaries were very odd. In other non-WP work, I've got very confused around Maida Vale, Queens Park and Kensal Green in NW London, where there were detached (or barely attached) portions of Chelsea, Fulham, Paddington and Hammersmith. Streatham used to include what is now Balham, and Streatham Cemetery is still between Tooting and Earlsfield. Johnlp (talk) 16:57, 17 April 2023 (UTC)

Wrong User(موش خرابکار)

Hello Please see the edits of the Persian page related to Palermo club Both you and I know that "Buffon" was not a member of Palermo! I have edited several times but this user@AWQyui is vandalizing and even insulting which I am sending you to delete Thank you for taking care VikCity1 (talk) 06:00, 20 April 2023 (UTC)

Category:Mandatory Palestine expatriates in Germany has been nominated for renaming

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Category:Mandatory Palestine expatriates in Switzerland has been nominated for renaming

Category:Mandatory Palestine expatriates in Switzerland has been nominated for renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Laurel Lodged (talk) 12:59, 27 April 2023 (UTC)

Category:Mandatory Palestine expatriates in Lebanon has been nominated for renaming

Category:Mandatory Palestine expatriates in Lebanon has been nominated for renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Laurel Lodged (talk) 13:01, 27 April 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Belgian expatriate sportspeople in Venezuela

A tag has been placed on Category:Belgian expatriate sportspeople in Venezuela indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Mandatory Palestine people of Yugoslav descent

A tag has been placed on Category:Mandatory Palestine people of Yugoslav descent indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Yugoslav people of French descent

A tag has been placed on Category:Yugoslav people of French descent indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:People from Mestre-Carpenedo

A tag has been placed on Category:People from Mestre-Carpenedo indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Category:Sportspeople by region in Germany has been nominated for renaming

Category:Sportspeople by region in Germany has been nominated for renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Laurel Lodged (talk) 14:09, 20 May 2023 (UTC)

Category:Sportspeople by province in Italy has been nominated for renaming

Category:Sportspeople by province in Italy has been nominated for renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Laurel Lodged (talk) 14:10, 20 May 2023 (UTC)

Category:Sportspeople by province in Spain has been nominated for renaming

Category:Sportspeople by province in Spain has been nominated for renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Laurel Lodged (talk) 14:14, 20 May 2023 (UTC)

Category:Sportspeople by county in Wales has been nominated for renaming

Category:Sportspeople by county in Wales has been nominated for renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Laurel Lodged (talk) 14:21, 20 May 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Bosnia and Herzegovina sportspeople by country of descent

A tag has been placed on Category:Bosnia and Herzegovina sportspeople by country of descent indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Rugby categories

Hello, Crowsus,

I clearly wandered into a subject area that is carefully maintained by other editors. But, can you explain to me, if these categories are being emptied and tagged for deletion because they are small categories, what about several of the categories in Category:Rugby union players from Kent, for example? Most of these categories are small categories, too. Is it just because those other categories tagged for deletion were created by Geoff3Cae? Thanks for any explanation you can provide. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:51, 3 June 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Liz:, I had been kinda ignoring the 'Rugby players from random village' categories til recently but decided it should be tidied up when I started doing some 'Sportsmen from London Borough of Foo' stuff and also noticed that Geoff3Cae had been banned, so those were the first I moved (and therefore emptied) as I went through them. It should all maybe go through CfD and maybe that is the best option for all the others but I would be happy to go through and upmerge them manually (he diligently went through every rugby player in the UK and created a From cat for each, regardless of size of the birthplace. Some localities even got a rugby union cat before they had a People from cat, conversely a few do happen to have sufficient numbers to justify being kept). I don't see it as an urgent thing, but there are unlikely to be many additions to these microcats, all that can be added have been, so at some point they should be binned before that kinda stuff is seen as the norm. Happy to go with whatever you recommend. Crowsus (talk) 22:28, 3 June 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Sportspeople from Campo Grande

A tag has been placed on Category:Sportspeople from Campo Grande indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Jordan–Yugoslavia relations

A tag has been placed on Category:Jordan–Yugoslavia relations indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Canadian expatriate ice hockey players in the United Arab Emirates

A tag has been placed on Category:Canadian expatriate ice hockey players in the United Arab Emirates indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Icelandic expatriate sportspeople in the Czech Republic

A tag has been placed on Category:Icelandic expatriate sportspeople in the Czech Republic indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Myanmar–New Zealand relations

A tag has been placed on Category:Myanmar–New Zealand relations indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Sportspeople

You can tweak Petscan by trying different intersections; eg this gives more articles for Iceland/Czech. You can get bizarre results with Petscan, usually the result of some error in the category tree (eg if people put the whole Category:Diego Maradona into Argentinian footballers). — Oculi (talk) 12:29, 10 June 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Nigerian emigrants to France

A tag has been placed on Category:Nigerian emigrants to France indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Saint Vincent and the Grenadines expatriate sportspeople in Japan

A tag has been placed on Category:Saint Vincent and the Grenadines expatriate sportspeople in Japan indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Wikipedia and licensing

Copyright and licensing are often complex and confusing concepts, so please don't take this as a criticism of you, just a clarification. In this edit ([2]), you told someone I would like to reassure you that your contributions will not be erased - for one thing, you don't own them, they are now the property of Wikipedia. That is not accurate. While editors do agree to license their edits under the CC-BY-SA 4.0, and that such licensing is irrevocable and perpetual, the editor who made the edit does retain the copyright to any edits they make (and could even take action in regards to it, if for example someone used material they wrote and did not comply with the CC-BY-SA license terms). Edits do not become the "property of Wikipedia", nor of the Wikimedia Foundation or anyone else. Seraphimblade ^{Talk to me} 07:28, 18 June 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for your time. I'll take your word for it, but that's pretty much the opposite vibe from the disclaimer on every edit. Crowsus (talk) 13:50, 18 June 2023 (UTC)

Discussion at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 June 18 § Category:Association football people by prefecture in Japan

 You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 June 18 § Category:Association football people by prefecture in Japan. Qwerfjkltalk 16:38, 18 June 2023 (UTC)

Empty categories

Hello, Crowsus,

I just tagged some categories you created for being empty categories. But I can see that these notices really overwhelm your User talk page so I reverted my edits. If you are curious about which categories they are, you can go into your page history to see them listed. I'm kind of stickler for notifications to let editors know when pages they have created might be deleted but I apologize for all of these notices. I will continue to post them if it's just one or two categories at a time but when it is a bunch, I'll just post and then revert myself if that is okay with you. Thank you. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:09, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

It's no problem, please do whatever you normally would for the process, but thanks for being considerate. It is a source of slight trepidation when I see I have 10 news items because that often means an argument is in the offing (I don't enjoy conflict, but I regularly do things that might lead to conflict!) so it is a nice relief to see its only a few categories that I probably shouldn't have created in the first place. Crowsus (talk) 20:49, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Category:Emigrants from the United Kingdom to British Overseas Territories has been nominated for renaming

Category:Emigrants from the United Kingdom to British Overseas Territories has been nominated for renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Marcocapelle (talk) 04:55, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

British emigrants

I am thinking we need to say that while people in British Overseas territories are not 100% British, they can still be placed in British categories if that is the most sensible and easiest way to avoid creating a permanent micro category.John Pack Lambert (talk) 12:34, 21 June 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Australian people of Bruneian descent

A tag has been placed on Category:Australian people of Bruneian descent indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:33, 23 June 2023 (UTC)

National Basketball Association venues by team CFD nomination

Thank you for contributing comments to the discussion at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 June 19#National Basketball Association venues by team. Your iVote to "Merge" is a common perspective on many categories for discussion where the subcategory doesn't make sense but you want to keep articles in the same tree. And you're trying to persuade other editors to your perspective, which is great.

In this case though, you've implemented your preferred solution without while the nomination is still open. That makes it harder for editors who are late to the party to come to their own conclusions because they can't see how the categories were originally set up. It also doesn't follow the normal closure process, which is at WP:CfDClosings.

Would you be willing to repopulate the venue categories you emptied and remove the venues you added directly to the team categories? - RevelationDirect (talk) 23:42, 23 June 2023 (UTC)

See discussion. A permanent (as long as the team exists in that format) tenant is not equatable to OCVENUE. Crowsus (talk) 19:10, 24 June 2023 (UTC)

Maybe, but venues should not be added directly to the team categories anyway. Eponymous topic categories should not be cluttered up with random articles with unspecified connections to the topic. 'What links here' does that. Oculi (talk) 14:09, 26 June 2023 (UTC)

Barnstar

		The Half Barnstar
		Really appreciate your willingness to rethink an approach and figure out how to move forward. Great working with you! RevelationDirect (talk) 02:04, 26 June 2023 (UTC)

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Macedonian sportspeople by country of descent

A tag has been placed on Category:Macedonian sportspeople by country of descent indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:40, 1 July 2023 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for July 2

An automated process has detected that when you recently edited Callaghan, you added links pointing to the disambiguation pages Daniel Callaghan, John Callaghan and Thomas Callaghan.

(Opt-out instructions.) --DPL bot (talk) 06:02, 2 July 2023 (UTC)

I have sent you a note about a page you started

Hello, Crowsus. Thank you for your work on Stadium relocations in Scottish football. User:SunDawn, while examining this page as a part of our page curation process, I had the following comments:

Hello! I want to inform you that I have checked your article and mark it as reviewed. Have a good day and thanks for creating the article!

To reply, leave a comment here and begin it with {{Re|SunDawn}}. Please remember to sign your reply with ~~~~. (Message delivered via the Page Curation tool, on behalf of the reviewer.)

✠ SunDawn ✠ (contact) 09:19, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

ANI Notice

There is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding lack of civility in WP:CFD. Thank you. RevelationDirect (talk) 04:07, 7 July 2023 (UTC)

Categories for team players and People from X

I can see arguments both ways for inclusion or removal of parenting such as [3], but please would you go through your edit history and ensure that you also remove any {{Non-diffusing subcategory}} templates along with removing the category, and also remove the corresponding {{Non-diffusing parent category}} from the former parents?

As things currently stand, you have left behind a trail of false and confusing statements on category pages. – Fayenatic London 08:42, 12 July 2023 (UTC)

Non diffusing templates have been misused whenever they have been added to such categories. If I spot them while removing the erroneous 'from' category, I'll take them out too. Crowsus (talk) 13:43, 12 July 2023 (UTC)

Invitation

Hello Crowsus!

• The New Pages Patrol is currently struggling to keep up with the influx of new articles needing review. We could use a few extra hands to help.
• We think that someone with your activity and experience is very likely to meet the guidelines for granting.
• Reviewing/patrolling a page doesn't take much time, but it requires a strong understanding of Wikipedia’s CSD policy and notability guidelines.
• Kindly read the tutorial before making your decision, and feel free to post on the project talk page with questions.
• If patrolling new pages is something you'd be willing to help out with, please consider applying here.

Thank you for your consideration. We hope to see you around!

Sent by Zippybonzo using MediaWiki message delivery (talk) at 10:30, 16 July 2023 (UTC)

I have sent you a note about a page you started

Hello, Crowsus. Thank you for your work on Kirsty Maclean. User:SunDawn, while examining this page as a part of our page curation process, I had the following comments:

Hey there! Hope you're having a great day. Thank you for contributing to Wikipedia with your article. I'm happy to inform you that your article has adhered to Wikipedia's policies, so I've marked it as reviewed. Have a fantastic day for you and your family!

To reply, leave a comment here and begin it with {{Re|SunDawn}}. Please remember to sign your reply with ~~~~. (Message delivered via the Page Curation tool, on behalf of the reviewer.)

✠ SunDawn ✠ (contact) 12:02, 16 July 2023 (UTC)

@SunDawn: thanks - do you have access to the previous version of the article which was deleted in 2022 (had barely started her career so less sources etc) so I can add anything missing from my version into it - with attribution to the original editor of course. Doubt there will be much so no big deal if it would be a problem. Crowsus (talk) 19:09, 16 July 2023 (UTC)

It is deleted through the AFD process, the only way to recover it is through deletion review and I didn't think the previous article have enough content anyway. Thanks. ✠ SunDawn ✠ (contact) 02:12, 17 July 2023 (UTC)

Our edit war

This and this are bad moves. Your explicit motivation is that wikilinks are missing. This is not acceptable motivation. As you say on my talk page, it can be seen as a kind of incompleteness. But again, this is not acceptable motivation. These summaries were requested. You even reinstated those requests. I provided summaries. Those summaries without wikilinks are better than no summaries. Removing the summaries takes away material that is supposed to be there. These actions by you make the articles more incomplete. Ettrig (talk) 13:50, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

You have three choices:

• make the small effort as requested and add the links to these two articles (as I've said before, I have no interest in your many other 'improved' intros which are not on my watch list)
• cut your losses on these two articles and move on to something else
• report my actions, and we'll see how other editors feel about your self-appointed mission to combat short intro tags by replacing them with overly long intros with no effort to format them properly, and indicating you have no intention of doing so when asked politely (WP:BOOMERANG)

Crowsus (talk) 16:44, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

Ah, you think it would be a mall effort to add the wikilinks. You also show clearly that you think it is important that those wikilinks are added. You also have reinstated the requests that the introductory summaries are added. Why do you remove the summaries instead of fixing them? This is a mystery. No article is complete from the beginning. Different editors contribute in different ways. My summaries are contributions. Your removals are the opposite. No editor has duties. You seem to imply that I have the duty to add wikilinks. This is just not true. It seems that your tactic is to force me to add wikilinks by the method of edit warring. Such behaviour is just not acceptable in Wikipedia. I have no idea what formating problems you see. Please exemplify. --Ettrig (talk) 18:23, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

I'm not forcing you to do anything, I asked you politely to add the links to one specific article which would raise the quality of your edit from sub-standard to acceptable, you declined and happened to add the same sub-standard edit to another article on my list. So both were reverted. It is the duty of someone to add the links, and as the contributor of the edit, it should primarily be yours. Since you feel that task is beneath you, your attitude compels me to remove your contribution entirely. But I haven't forced you to do anything. I asked, you declined, your choice. If you just add the links to these two articles problem solved. But it's not my job, nor anyone else's, to clean up after you in basic formatting because you feel you and your edits are so important that you need to fly off to the next short lead emergency without stopping to complete the task in hand. Such behaviour is just not acceptable in Wikipedia.

. Crowsus (talk) 18:43, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

As you have been here for 15 years and not 15 days, it is obvious that you are playing dumb. However, since you asked the question, I will play along: MOS:LEADLINK should be of some help. Crowsus (talk) 18:48, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

@Ettrig:I just want to say I agree with Crowsus. The rapidity and quality of these additions, which have hints of being AI-generated considering this conversation and their often odd turns of phrase, are in aggregate an issue. They are subpar quality, and leave a trail of leads needing significant improvement. It is not unreasonable to ask you take the time to follow the MOS if you are going to mass remove templates indicating improvement is needed. Cerebral726 (talk) 19:39, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

Again, there is almost no concrete criticism. "subpar quality", "AI-generated", "odd turns of phrase". These are sweeping value judgments. "mass remove templates" sounds almost bad, but it refers to the phenomenon of a lot of requested work being done. This is a good thing, right? It should not be met with destructive removals. --Ettrig (talk) 21:01, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

By removing the templates and adding subpar summaries missing basic wikilinks, formatting errors, and subtle flaws, there is no longer a sign that the lead needs the attention of editors. Instead, all of these articles with the need for well written leads have poorly written longer leads and no indication they are flawed without closer inspection. For specifics, this edit had no links, no italics, weirdly mentions she separated from her husband in 2020 in the lead for no particular reason, and said "education streaming services" instead of "educational streaming services". It required me to perform these fixes. I believe if you spent a little extra time on each of these edits, these lead fixes would be invaluable, as others have also expressed. If multiple editors have expressed concern with your edits, do you think it might be time to try to take the intent of our criticisms into account and alter your methods? Cerebral726 (talk) 21:12, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

"If multiple editors ..." This is a big if. As you seem to have seen, I have created a very large number of summaries. I monitor them till I see they are edited. To a very large extent there is no explicit reaction. There are many more thanks than criticisms. I looked at the edit that you linked. That summary is much better than nothing, before your edit. Some of your changes are a matter of personal taste, some are trivial, some are valuable. All in all, making those changes is much less work than writing the summary from scratch. So I have contributed to getting that work done. So I see no ground for complaint and not for edit war. --Ettrig (talk) 22:21, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

It's not a big if. Myself, Crowsus, memphisto, CactiStaccingCrane DreamRimmer, and Dmartin969 have all expressed varying levels of concern with your edits. Just taking a slower pace and bothering to format titles of works with italics, add wikilinks, make sure weird extraneous details aren't include, are well sourced for BLPs, etc. would be worthwhile and appreciated. You are clearly acting in good faith, but you should listen to others as well and try to find some value from the criticisms. Cerebral726 (talk) 12:58, 19 July 2023 (UTC)

@Ettrig Don't try to be a rockstar. Take your time and learn the actual skills, instead of just relying on experiences and bulldoze the boring practice. Multiple long time editors have been shunned/blocked for not listening to others' feedback. Don't be one of them. CactiStaccingCrane (talk) 14:08, 20 July 2023 (UTC)

Too late for now, but hopefully your advice will be heeded if there is a comeback... Crowsus (talk) 14:20, 20 July 2023 (UTC)

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Disambiguation link notification for July 30

An automated process has detected that when you recently edited David Ginola, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page John Gregory.

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Proposed merger discussion

I am sending you this message because you have previously edited at least one of the pages involved in this proposal. There seems to be a considerable amount of overlap between the two articles Cathkin Park (1872–1903) and Cathkin Park, with both articles actually referring to the other with what I believe is called a hatnote. I am proposing that these two articles be merged into one, and since it would make more sense for the merged article to be titled Cathlkin Park, without reference to any specific date, I am proposing that we merge Cathkin Park (1872–1903) into Cathkin Park. If you are interested in participating in this discussion please reply on the talk page of Cathkin Park. Cottonshirtτ 03:24, 3 August 2023 (UTC)

No thanks, they were two different stadiums in two different locations. Crowsus (talk) 08:26, 3 August 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Zimbabwean expatriate basketball people in France

A tag has been placed on Category:Zimbabwean expatriate basketball people in France indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 16:36, 6 August 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Zimbabwean expatriate basketball people in Germany

A tag has been placed on Category:Zimbabwean expatriate basketball people in Germany indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 16:36, 6 August 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Zimbabwean expatriate basketball people in Italy

A tag has been placed on Category:Zimbabwean expatriate basketball people in Italy indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 16:36, 6 August 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Malian expatriate basketball people in Japan

A tag has been placed on Category:Malian expatriate basketball people in Japan indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 17:08, 12 August 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Malian expatriate sportspeople in Japan

A tag has been placed on Category:Malian expatriate sportspeople in Japan indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Malian expatriates in Japan

A tag has been placed on Category:Malian expatriates in Japan indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Japan–Mali relations

A tag has been placed on Category:Japan–Mali relations indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Algerian expatriate sportspeople in Lithuania

A tag has been placed on Category:Algerian expatriate sportspeople in Lithuania indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Algeria–South Sudan relations

A tag has been placed on Category:Algeria–South Sudan relations indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

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David Watson (footballer, born 2005)

Hello! About what you wrote in your latest edit on the page, I just wanted to chime in and say that it wasn't my intention at all to criticize the job you did: I just thought a third pair of eyes could have helped improve the article even more... Oltrepier (talk) 17:01, 3 September 2023 (UTC)

Autopatrolled granted

Hi Crowsus, I just wanted to let you know that I have added the autopatrolled user right to your account. This means that pages you create will automatically be marked as 'reviewed', and no longer appear in the new pages feed. Autopatrolled is assigned to prolific creators of articles, where those articles do not require further review, and may have been requested on your behalf by someone else. It doesn't affect how you edit; it is used only to manage the workload of new page patrollers.

Since the articles you create will no longer be systematically reviewed by other editors, it is important that you maintain the high standard you have achieved so far in all your future creations. Please also try to remember to add relevant WikiProject templates, stub tags, categories, and incoming links to them, if you aren't already in the habit; user scripts such as Rater and StubSorter can help with this. As you have already shown that you have a strong grasp of Wikipedia's core content policies, you might also consider volunteering to become a new page patroller yourself, helping to uphold the project's standards and encourage other good faith article writers.

Feel free to leave me a message if you have any questions. Happy editing! – Joe (talk) 05:48, 8 September 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Japanese expatriate sportspeople in Northern Ireland

A tag has been placed on Category:Japanese expatriate sportspeople in Northern Ireland indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 23:19, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Macedonian expatriate sportspeople in Liechtenstein

A tag has been placed on Category:Macedonian expatriate sportspeople in Liechtenstein indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. ✗plicit 14:51, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

'From' categories

A player is born in New York whilst his British parents are on holiday. They go back to the UK 3 days later and he never returns to the USA. Would you still have him as 'from New York'? No, of course not. GiantSnowman 18:02, 26 September 2023 (UTC)

Category:Emigrants from British Overseas Territories to the United Kingdom has been nominated for renaming

Category:Emigrants from British Overseas Territories to the United Kingdom has been nominated for renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Mason (talk) 02:49, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

CfD nomination at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 October 1 § X by Y in Z

A category or categories you have created have been nominated for possible deletion, merging, or renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 October 1 § X by Y in Z on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Qwerfjkltalk 11:31, 1 October 2023 (UTC)

Category:West German expatriates in New Caledonia has been nominated for discussion

Category:West German expatriates in New Caledonia has been nominated for possible deletion, merging, or renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 15:11, 1 October 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Canadian expatriate ice hockey players in West Germany

A tag has been placed on Category:Canadian expatriate ice hockey players in West Germany indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:33, 6 October 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Canadian expatriate ice hockey players in the United Arab Emirates

A tag has been placed on Category:Canadian expatriate ice hockey players in the United Arab Emirates indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:32, 20 October 2023 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Canadian expatriate ice hockey players in the United Arab Emirates

A tag has been placed on Category:Canadian expatriate ice hockey players in the United Arab Emirates indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:06, 31 October 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Liz:, the editor in question has not discussed on Talk as you requested but has instead referred to a 'Consensus at WikiProject Ice Hockey' (without linking to it).

So I have decided to go another way, I will let this specific category fall away and instead when I come across those players (all Canadian by the way, so I don't see how any project consensus is being applied when it it is only being applied to those of a single nationality, and it seems only the one editor is taking this action so it appears more to be a case of WP:IDONTLIKEIT to me), I will adjust the categories to be Fooian expatriate sportspeople in Bar plus Expatriate ice hockey players in Bar and an overarching Canadian expatriate ice hockey players - this will create more categories on each article but mirrors the pattern used by other sports like (association) football and the rugby codes so is not inaccurate or excessively vague or atypical for groupings, and is no longer so far into in the scope of WikiProject [Canadian] Ice Hockey so the opinion of one or two editors does not hold sway over site-wide conventions - if they want to instigate a discussion about the merits of the entire tree and reasoning for Expatriate sportspeople, that's fine and there will be a range of view and opinions and the entire community can reach a consensus which we can all abide by.

Until then, I will follow the conventions for every other sport (albeit this categorisation is all fairly new as a concept on Wikipedia, last 5 years or so) which is whenever a sportsperson of one nationality is employed in another nation, the relevant Expatriate cats should be used (and these do not expire or exist arbitrarily with the individual editor deciding whether it's 'relevant' or 'outdated' as has been used to justify removing them from the hockey players). Crowsus (talk) 23:20, 31 October 2023 (UTC)

Sportspeople by town

Excuse me for asking, but why have you been going round emptying English and Welsh sportspeople by town and/or county categories categories? They are part of a scheme which includes sportspeople by town and city in just about every country in the world, and it's taking a lot of time to replace the category tags you removed. Please stop! I suspect you probably have a reason for doing so, but at the moment it simply looks like vandalism. What is the reason for doing it? Grutness...wha? 06:15, 2 November 2023 (UTC)

Yeah, this is disruptive and needs to stop and be undone immediately. I know for a fact that Category:Snooker players from Neath had at least 4 players in it, and 4 articles is certainly enough for a category. See also WP:FAITACCOMPLI and Wikipedia:Categories for discussion, in particular: "Except in uncontroversial cases such as reverting vandalism, do not amend or depopulate a category once it has been nominated at CfD as this hampers other editors' efforts to evaluate a category and participate in the discussion." See further Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/How-to#Notifying interested projects and editors, which you did not follow. If you don't go clean up this mess, and quickly before the CfD bot acts on all your improper emptying and speedy-deletion tagging, it is likely grounds for a topic-ban from recategorization and category deletion.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  09:02, 2 November 2023 (UTC)

@SMcCandlish: Crowsus has moved over 2000 articles and there are now around 300 rugby union/league player by town categories up for speedy deletion. I've moved a lot of the articles back, but it's exhausting work without a bot. I suspect that Crowsus considered the categories too small, and rather than go through the proper process (list them at cfd without emptying them) he/she simply emptied them so that they would be listed for speedy deletion. In mitigation, he/she didn't mark them for speedy deletion personally, but they were quickly spotted by User:Liz who has done so. Several of the categories had 7-10 articles - well over the usual minimum needed. Grutness...wha? 09:42, 2 November 2023 (UTC)

Fargh. I recently WP:ANIed someone for unconstructive and rule-breaking WP:MEATBOT activity of this sort, but am not looking forward to doing it again (especially since Crowsus does not seem to be generally as reckless as that other party). Crowsus, just cleaning up your own mess is the right thing to do.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  09:50, 2 November 2023 (UTC)

I've bought time by removing all the speedy templates, and partially refilled quite a few of the categories, but there are a lot still empty and someone else is bound to tag them soon (check my contrib list to see all the categories which I untagged). I'm sure there's no vandalous intent here - just looks like someone picked the wrong way to go about getting rid of small categories (and misjudged the minimum category size). Grutness...wha? 10:13, 2 November 2023 (UTC)

Nothing to add, except that I've arrived here due to similar bafflement at this campaign. Mutt Lunker (talk) 10:21, 2 November 2023 (UTC)

Hi everyone!

• Mutt, I'll deal with yours first since I remember it: you created a Sportspeople from Valleyfield with 3 entries, while People from Valleyfield was only 4 articles. Pretty pointless IMO and it stood out for its very small cat size representing a very small population with little room for growth and no consistency in a local sense (e.g Glenrothes does not have a Sportspeople cat although about 10 of its articles are sportspeople, and its size and status as a new town suggest that more young people living there will grow up to be notable) but it can be very quickly rectified if it has some special meaning to you.
• SMcCandlish, yes snooker players from Neath had 4 and the other Welsh ones each had 3 members which I think meets some kind of minimum somewhere but a grouping of 3 Welsh snooker players by town again seems to add no real value to anything. But they're back now so all is right with the world there.
• The rugby ones were all created 2 years ago by user:Geoff3Cae who was indef blocked (see 5 January 2022 in their talk) precisely for creating microcategories in that area and refusing to engage when it was questioned. In many cases there wasn't a 'Sportspeople from' category for the place in question and sometimes not even a 'People from', they just went through and created a category no matter the situation. It was that editor who was breaking convention, most of them should never have been created so I decided to sort it as I was sick of looking at them. What I have done is rearrange the 232(!) Category:Rugby union players by city or town in England so that the articles for the tiny Town categories are now under the County, and under Sportspeople for the place. To me this looks like a much healthier and more navigable list than before,for instance Category:Rugby union players from Tyne and Wear now has a respectable 31 members plus 27 for Newcastle, rather than those 31 divided into 6 towns with 5 members each, who does that benefit? I think Gateshead maybe had 8 members so yeah it's valid in terms of raw numbers but to what end, when taking it up a level along with others of that size is still a very middling total for anyone interested in the subject. Had the County category been created as a list of the 31 articles rather than just a holder for all the towns, I highly doubt there would have been a clamour for it to be split 10 ways just because it was a possibility. Category:Rugby union players from Somerset also now has 31 plus 12 Taunton and 29 Bath, a reasonable number for anyone scanning a list and in my opinion far more practical than the previous ~5 plus 5 each in 5 town mini-lists. There's just no need for that level of categorisation by sport and place purely because such an intersection can exist. Compare the rugby union list to Category:Rugby league players by city or town in England which I haven't gone through, it is a lot smaller to start with and you can see there are plenty of valid categories there but also a pretty tragic collection of 1s and 2s, as well as the likes of Category:Rugby league players from Northampton with 3 members which is also the entirety of Category:Rugby league players from Northamptonshire. If we're talking about sets, in my opinion it's more logical to have a category for each county rather than for towns at random, so then Northampton would go and the articles moved to Rugby league players from Northamptonshire and Sportspeople from Northampton. Should have notified the projects, but since nobody seemed to care 2 years ago when they were all created in an incorrect manner, I thought nobody would be that bothered either if I made an effort to fix it.
• I'll leave it there for now and await replies.

Crowsus (talk) 11:34, 2 November 2023 (UTC)

My concern regarded the campaign as a whole, not the deleted category which alerted me to it. Mutt Lunker (talk) 11:40, 2 November 2023 (UTC)

FWIW the "very small population with little room for growth" now has twice as many sportspeople candidates (6) in the parent category, should the subcat be revived. There are a couple more that I believe to be from there but I've failed to find citations, as yet. Consistency, if desired, can as well be facilitated by creation as by deletion. Mutt Lunker (talk) 13:35, 2 November 2023 (UTC)

I have restored the category. Mutt Lunker (talk) 16:04, 4 November 2023 (UTC)

To address the points above, such categories are not "pointless" since they are narrower than the broader one you want to forcibly upmerge into. They are more precise intersections. While it is true we don't want to create a category like this for a single entry, small ones with multiple entries are not any sort of problem. If you're convinced they're a problem anyway, we have WP:CFD process for this; your personal opinion doesn't determine sweeping categorization decisions here, a broader consensus does that. And we do not blindly undo every single thing some blocked editor did just because they were blocked.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  12:17, 2 November 2023 (UTC)

Crowsus, can you please rollback your own edits? There are still currently about 265 empty categories. It is not reasonable to expect others to pick up the slack. ✗plicit 12:34, 2 November 2023 (UTC)

(after EC) I agree with SMcC on this - these categories are useful, and - as I pointed out in my original post - are part of a scheme across many sports and almost all countries. It's the way they've been categorised across Wikipedia for a considerable time with a good deal of consensus among editors (look at just how many editors have made and populated these categories). If you as one editor think there's a problem with having categories of this nature, then the way to deal with it is to start a discussion about it at WP:CFD or at a relevant WikiProject. Sure, being bold is tolerated and even encouraged in article space, but not in categories. IMO, the sooner you start undoing your edits and repopulating the categories, the better. If there are any that remain unworkably small (three articles or under) after that, then take them to CFD. Don't simply depopulate them and leave others to clear up the mess. Grutness...wha? 12:37, 2 November 2023 (UTC)

"part of a scheme across many sports and almost all countries. It's the way they've been categorised across Wikipedia for a considerable time" - creating categories with 1 or 2 entries for a specific sport for every single locality in the UK, in some cases 3 levels below the existing tree, is not the way it's been done. As I pointed out, the editor's failure to abide by those conventions - followed by ignoring all attempts to interact about it - got them banned.

"look at just how many editors have made and populated these categories", are you talking about Rugby union players by city or town in England etc? Because nobody touched ANY of the categories themselves since Geoff3Cae. I can't tell who added articles to each cat of course, but if enough were added to make a decent total, I didn't touch them.

I haven't blindly undone anything. As I said, many of Geoff3Cae's creations were fine so why would I touch them. But they clearly got carried away: the "precision" in creating separate Rugby league players from Dearham and Rugby union players from Dearham categories with 2 entries each (actually 1 of them is a man who played both codes), where no Sportspeople from Dearham category exists, is clearly ludicrous and in contravention of WP:SMALLCAT.

However, I also got carried away trying to tidy it up, and should have left the ones over 4 as I am aware that is an accepted threshold. Although since you mention WP:CFD I should point out that I have seen many, many categories of similar "precise intersections" deleted there.

I will repopulate the larger ones in approximately 12 hours when I have the time.

Howevey Crowsus (talk) 13:04, 2 November 2023 (UTC)

...creating categories with 1 or 2 entries for a specific sport for every single locality in the UK, in some cases 3 levels below the existing tree, is not the way it's been done. This doesn't explain why you have depopulated many categories with 7-10 entries. While deleting works by a banned editor makes sense, it doesn't make sense if those entries are in use and acceptable to Wikipedia - which those categories are.

...where no Sportspeople from [...] category exists, is clearly ludicrous and in contravention of WP:SMALLCAT. Um - have you actually read WP:SMALLCAT? "this criterion does not preclude all small categories; a category which does have realistic potential for growth [...] may be kept even if only a small number of its articles actually exist at the present time." I should also point out that WP:SMALLCAT is deprecated.

Although since you mention WP:CFD I should point out that I have seen many, many categories of similar "precise intersections" deleted there. - which should have been a clue that such categories are taken to CFD, rather than simply being emptied.

Grutness...wha? 02:11, 3 November 2023 (UTC)

You're right of course, and I apologise to all involved for the time wasted here. Going way above the standard minimum to suit my own preferences was beyond a poor decision and in fact just a dick move and I can only say that I got carried away while (in my eyes) fixing the tiny ones; by doing so I actually ruined any chance of tolerance / sympathy towards the idea of the upmerge of the tiny ones - notwithstanding that it was the incorrect procedure to empty those manually.

As far as I am aware, all the >3 categories have now been restored - I went through each of them using Petscan for any eligible articles which hadn't been added before and managed to find a couple. I also went through the <3, they are still empty for now [shorthand for results here ], I am not refusing to repopulate, but hoping for a delay to be allowed to present them to CfD for consideration along with the very small Rugby League players categories, to demonstrate that I can behave properly in this area and will abide by the consensus there - and if that is to restore some or all of the Rugby union players etc I will do so as soon as possible (may not be absolutely immediately due to commitments IRL).

Beyond that, just to confirm that I will fully cooperate in any discussions, sanctions and/or restrictions which may result from my actions. I hope at least to avoid an indef site ban which would be a greatly unhappy end to 7 years of generally positive contributions. But solely my fault if it did come to that. Crowsus (talk) 02:32, 4 November 2023 (UTC)

Thank you. I don't think you've "ruined any chance of tolerance / sympathy towards the idea of the upmerge of the tiny ones", but it's still far better to go through cfd. Some of the small ones should probably be deleted, or at least converted into general sportspeople categories where there aren't any. I can understand how easy it is to get carried away on projects like this (I got into trouble myself for a related issue a couple of years ago). I certainly wouldn't expect a site-wide ban situation, but I suspect you might face restrictions on some areas of editing if anyone wants to take this further. Cheers, Grutness...wha? 06:18, 4 November 2023 (UTC)

I don't want to do that, and yes thank you for fixing it, and reviewing the applicable material and adjusting your view based on that. I wish more editors were that flexible!  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  07:40, 4 November 2023 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free image File:Drumchapel United logo.jpeg

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Note that any non-free images not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described in section F5 of the criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. --B-bot (talk) 18:19, 13 November 2023 (UTC)

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Category:Rowers by city or town in Italy has been nominated for renaming

Category:Rowers by city or town in Italy has been nominated for renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Mason (talk) 23:06, 28 December 2023 (UTC)

Happy New Year, Crowsus!

Happy New Year!

Crowsus,
Have a prosperous, productive and enjoyable New Year, and thanks for your contributions to Wikipedia.
Abishe (talk) 15:37, 1 January 2024 (UTC)

   Send New Year cheer by adding {{subst:Happy New Year fireworks}} to user talk pages.

Abishe (talk) 15:37, 1 January 2024 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Canadian expatriate sportspeople in Myanmar

A tag has been placed on Category:Canadian expatriate sportspeople in Myanmar indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:58, 1 January 2024 (UTC)

Scotland related recategorisations

I see you've moved a number of organisations (eg Scottish Law Commission) from the Organisations based in Edinburgh category to the Companies based in Edinburgh subcategory. I don't think this is correct, for the simple reason that they are public sector organisations rather than companies. They might more appropriately appear in the Government-related organisations based in Edinburgh subcategory. George Burgess (talk) 14:24, 8 January 2024 (UTC)

Apologies! I totally agree. Must have mis-clicked. That is where I meant to move them to, and have now done. Crowsus (talk) 19:39, 8 January 2024 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for your work cleaning up cats. Just a note though that some of the cats that have been removed aren't actually in the parent articles. So, do you mind adding them to the parent articles when you remove them? Of course, you don't have to but it will save me the trouble. :) ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 04:45, 31 January 2024 (UTC)

Category redirects

Hello, Crowsus,

Category redirects are not like article redirects. Please take a look at Category:Berlin Capitals players and Category:Saschen Füchse players so you can see the code/template used for category redirects so that you can create them appropriately in the future. Thank you for your contributions! Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 03:18, 9 February 2024 (UTC)

Sorry and thanks, I have now saved that coding for future changes (and will fix a couple of other recent ones)... Crowsus (talk) 03:22, 9 February 2024 (UTC)

Good article reassessment for Coatbridge

Coatbridge has been nominated for a good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. Hog Farm _Talk 15:25, 10 February 2024 (UTC)

Category:British sportspeople by country of descent has been nominated for discussion

Category:British sportspeople by country of descent has been nominated for possible deletion, merging, or renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether it complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Place Clichy (talk) 23:17, 10 February 2024 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Mali–Canada relations

A tag has been placed on Category:Mali–Canada relations indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 19:58, 22 February 2024 (UTC)

February 2024

Hello, Crowsus, I saw that you made a draft for a new article at User:Crowsus/sandbox/Fernando Quintanilla. Short term hosting of potentially valid articles and other reasonable content under development or in active use is usually acceptable. But in this case, you haven't edited your draft for a long time. If you wish to improve the draft yourself, please do. Otherwise, you may consider donating it to WikiProject Abandoned Drafts (a participant can help). Thank you. Shadow311 (talk) 15:41, 28 February 2024 (UTC)

It became an article a few years ago. Not sure how to delete these draft pages - nominated it for speedy to hopefully annoy causing much of a nuisance, apologies if that's not the best way. Crowsus (talk) 17:04, 28 February 2024 (UTC)

Campeonato Regional Centro

hello, can you help me improve Campeonato Regional Centro page and editions. Thank you!

Help.Football.History (talk) 21:40, 7 March 2024 (UTC)

St Roch’s Principal

The current headteacher at St Roch’s Secondary School has changed, can you stop reverting it? Dreamcrab0 (talk) 10:34, 15 March 2024 (UTC)

You need a source for the change. For all I know, that's the the name of a random pupil (which frequently happens in school articles). Crowsus (talk) 11:06, 15 March 2024 (UTC)

I understand, where would I put the source? Dreamcrab0 (talk) 11:07, 15 March 2024 (UTC)

Thanks, right next to his name in the box please Crowsus (talk) 11:09, 15 March 2024 (UTC)

Could a source be from the official social media account of the school? Dreamcrab0 (talk) 11:11, 15 March 2024 (UTC)

Yeah that's fine for it. Crowsus (talk) 11:23, 15 March 2024 (UTC)

How do I add the source to the info? I don’t quite understand infoboxes. Dreamcrab0 (talk) 11:27, 15 March 2024 (UTC)

Can you see if the source is reliable? I don’t want to put any unreliable sources on Wikipedia. Dreamcrab0 (talk) 12:12, 15 March 2024 (UTC)

That's great cheers. If it's an organisation's own page, it should usually be OK for basic info unless saying something controversial or doubtful, which is not the case here. A secondary source is always preferable but their own page is much better than nothing. Crowsus (talk) 12:44, 15 March 2024 (UTC)

Category:Citizens of Hungary through descent has been nominated for merging

Category:Citizens of Hungary through descent has been nominated for merging. A discussion is taking place to decide whether it complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. HouseBlaster (talk · he/him) 16:10, 8 April 2024 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Kazakhstani expatriate basketball people in France

A tag has been placed on Category:Kazakhstani expatriate basketball people in France indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

Also affected:

• Category:Kazakhstani expatriate basketball people in Poland
• Category:Kazakhstani expatriate basketball people in Russia
• Category:Kazakhstani expatriate basketball people in Hungary

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. ✗plicit 14:57, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

Flemish men

I've reverted your additions to the Flemish men category. The consensus is that "Articles on individual men should not be added directly to categories like that one, but may be added to an appropriate sub-category if it exists." WP:EGRS has some good information about this, but generally, people aren't diffused to gender specific categories. Mason (talk) 21:14, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

FC Barcelona 6–1 Paris Saint-Germain F.C.

Why would you add back in two sources that don't mention the 2017 6-1 match at all? In fact, one of your additions was already removed previously for the same reason - by me, 12 hours ago! Can you explain this? Fred Zepelin (talk) 01:44, 23 April 2024 (UTC)

The changes both you and I have made to the wording and sourcing have improved the article and reduced it by over 2000 bytes from the point of your initial involvement. The source that does not explicity mention the PSG match, but is necessary as a reference for the match in question, is now followed by another source which lists all the mentioned matches in a commonality, justifying their inclusion on the article for that reason. Not sure if you noticed that, but it's there, so I have now restored that paragraph. If you still have an issue with it, I suggest you seek wider opinion at WP:FOOTY or a similar forum. Crowsus (talk) 02:22, 23 April 2024 (UTC)

This article mentions the 2017 match but "lists all the mentioned matches in a commonality" is a stretch. At best, you could use that source to say that this 2017 match was listed among the "Greatest Champions League comebacks of all time" by the BBC, but everything else you've added is cruft and original research. I'm not sure why you're so hell-bent on leaving this section of cruft in - did you write it originally? Do you consider it to be "your" work? Fred Zepelin (talk) 14:38, 23 April 2024 (UTC)

Since you're insisting on including those two unrelated matches, I started a discussion on the article talk page, so if you want to weigh in further, I suggest you do it there. Fred Zepelin (talk) 15:07, 23 April 2024 (UTC)

On a related note, what's with your edit summaries saying "per talk" when the only person on any talk page supporting your changes is you? You've made over 300,000 edits, so you obviously know better than to do that. I wouldn't try it again. Fred Zepelin (talk) 05:08, 24 April 2024 (UTC)

I dicuss what I'm doing here, and then the summary says 'per talk'. That is standard. Crowsus (talk) 08:22, 24 April 2024 (UTC)

"I wouldn't try it again", what does that mean, by the way? Crowsus (talk) 08:28, 24 April 2024 (UTC)

It means that, as of now, you've been warned about your disruptive editing, your WP:BATTLEGROUND mentality, and your edit warring, and if you continue to do any of those things, next stop is ANI. Fred Zepelin (talk) 18:29, 24 April 2024 (UTC)

See you there mate. I was actually gonna yield so I don't have to interact with you any more, but you know what, that's cool. It will be a huge drain on your time and your own behaviour (WP:CIVIL, WP:3RR, WP:BATTLEGROUND - it is me who has made efforts to compromise and resolve this constructively, whereas you have taken a position and remained immovable despite plentiful evidence contradicting your position on the validity of the content, and instead resorted pretty quickly to threats of administrative intervention) will be properly scrutinised. Crowsus (talk) 19:56, 24 April 2024 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Canadian expatriate sportspeople in Myanmar

A tag has been placed on Category:Canadian expatriate sportspeople in Myanmar indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:38, 23 April 2024 (UTC)

April 2024

You currently appear to be engaged in an edit war according to the reverts you have made on FC Barcelona 6–1 Paris Saint-Germain F.C.. This means that you are repeatedly changing content back to how you think it should be although other editors disagree. Users are expected to collaborate with others, to avoid editing disruptively, and to try to reach a consensus, rather than repeatedly undoing other users' edits once it is known that there is a disagreement.

Points to note:

1. Edit warring is disruptive regardless of how many reverts you have made;
2. Do not edit war even if you believe you are right.

If you find yourself in an editing dispute, use the article's talk page to discuss controversial changes and work towards a version that represents consensus among editors. You can post a request for help at an appropriate noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, it may be appropriate to request temporary page protection. If you engage in an edit war, you may be blocked from editing.  — Amakuru (talk) 08:40, 24 April 2024 (UTC)

Umm, where's Fred's warning? The content was already there for some time before they decided to remove it. It takes two sides to 'edit war' so kindly add your template to their talk. PS I added sources to the article before I saw this. Crowsus (talk) 08:56, 24 April 2024 (UTC)

Notice of edit warring noticeboard discussion

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion involving you at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring regarding a possible violation of Wikipedia's policy on edit warring. The thread is Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring#User:Crowsus reported by User:Fred Zepelin (Result: ). Thank you. Fred Zepelin (talk) 20:11, 24 April 2024 (UTC)

You have been blocked from editing FC Barcelona 6–1 Paris Saint-Germain F.C. for a period of 72 hours for edit warring. Once the block has expired, you are welcome to make useful contributions.

If you think there are good reasons for being unblocked, please review Wikipedia's guide to appealing blocks, then add the following text to the bottom of your talk page: {{unblock|reason=Your reason here ~~~~}}.  Daniel Case (talk) 16:42, 25 April 2024 (UTC)

Update on tel aviv heat information

Hi there - my telaviv heat info regarding points scored and caps is outdated would it be possible to update? 2603:8000:72F0:9360:6DA9:8EA7:7C52:A3AE (talk) 01:22, 27 April 2024 (UTC)

No idea what you're talking about, sorry. Crowsus (talk) 01:23, 27 April 2024 (UTC)

SC Concordia von 1907

Welcome to Wikipedia!

I edit here too, under the username MintyFresh201, and I thank you for your contributions. However, if you wouldn't mind could you please fix up SC Concordia von 1907, as you were the last contributor. Some of the information on this article is inaccurate as the club still exists, whereas the article classifies it as a defunct club. Thank you, MintyFresh201 (talk) 00:11, 9 May 2024 (UTC)

Iñaki Williams

Hi Crowsus. Thanks for improving Iñaki Williams. I reverted your change to the "Honours" section, it went against consensus. Kind regards, Robby.is.on (talk) 08:48, 29 May 2024 (UTC)

Hmm, I've finally checked the template and there is nothing there regarding the display of runners-up; if a consensus was reached at the project, I suggest a demonstration of the preferred formatting should be added to the template. Crowsus (talk) 00:27, 4 June 2024 (UTC)

You're right, it's not explicitly stated at Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/Players so my edit summary was inaccurate. From what I've seen the vast majority of footballers' honours section are formatted that way. That consensus needs to be codified in the manual of style. Kind regards, Robby.is.on (talk) 08:23, 4 June 2024 (UTC)

Category:People with acquired Syrian citizenship has been nominated for renaming

Category:People with acquired Syrian citizenship has been nominated for renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether it complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Omnis Scientia (talk) 19:23, 9 June 2024 (UTC)

Nomination of Rachel Walkingshaw for deletion

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Category:Footballers by region in France has been nominated for renaming to Category:Footballers from France by region

Category:Footballers by region in France has been nominated for renaming to Category:Footballers from France by region. A discussion is taking place to decide whether it complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you.

Thank you!

I just saw your message about Rossi/Alahverdians article. I had to take a few step back for legal reasons and I guess after the fact, a COI, but I’m thrilled that it’s all coming to light. He’s a real piece of work. GRINCHIDICAE🎄 19:28, 29 July 2024 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Icelandic expatriate sportspeople in the United Arab Emirates

A tag has been placed on Category:Icelandic expatriate sportspeople in the United Arab Emirates indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:48, 19 August 2024 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Icelandic expatriates in the United Arab Emirates

A tag has been placed on Category:Icelandic expatriates in the United Arab Emirates indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:50, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Iceland–United Arab Emirates relations

A tag has been placed on Category:Iceland–United Arab Emirates relations indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 02:05, 3 September 2024 (UTC)

Churruca

Hi there, thank you for adding the box to Churruca (what I had logged on to do). Just a few questions:

1. Where did you find Churruca's full managerial career? I've had this problem a few times when a player/manager was at such a low level it's not recorded on BDFutbol. With Paco Real, who rose from an amateur coach in the 1960s, I only found teams listed in an obituary, and the lack of certainty has meant I haven't tried to fill an infobox. I'm not doubting that what you wrote was true, as it corresponds with the Arenas Getxo managerial box.

2. How should the page be titled? The Spanish Wikipedia omits the José, and the Basque Wikipedia puts his name as "Txurruka", which looks like it's making a WP:POINT, given that most sources spell it Churruca. Most figures I write about were born in an era where they were forced into Castilian first names, so I look for WP:COMMONNAME, which is why I named another page Iñaki Hurtado. I see a few recent sources call Churruca "Iñaki", but a lot of sources are affected by that Spanish way of just calling a player by their surname. I made a page for another Basque Juan María Mujika where I'm half thinking that the common name should be Musti Mujika, whether that was a Basque name or just a nickname. Unknown Temptation (talk) 12:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Unknown Temptation:, thanks for the message. Good work with the international section. The manager stats are just from BDFutbol, there is a 'Community' tab showing the teams at levels below Segunda B - this is for players and coaches, but defaults as 'off', doesn't appear for those with no entries to be shown, might not appear in all browsers and I don't think it's been there for that long (maybe 2019?), might be useful for you on other articles, although maybe not much with Paco Real.

The title is up to you really, I've created a redirect at Iñaki so that should cover most searches etc, and I agree that Txurruka is Basque POV, it is the preferred spelling now but not at the time he was active. If it had been created at Iñaki with José Ignacio as redirect I don't think anyone would have objected, so don't see an issue the other way either. Same goes for Mujika in my opinion (another nice article and a long-time member of the 'obviously notable redlinked Spanish players' list), though I think either a Musti Mujika redirect or an addition at the Musti disambig page would be useful. Crowsus (talk) 22:06, 13 October 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for that. I have seen the community tab on some pages but to my knowledge it's unverified (?) so I've been treating it like Transfermarkt, "trust but verify". For some players it has recorded two or three appearances in seasons that they most likely had more, which suggests that somebody added the data for the opposing team's games and this came as collateral.

It's amazing that I once thought that everything on Wikipedia must already have been covered, but I've found lots of Copa del Rey/UEFA/UCWC final players and Spain internationals with no article. I think my biggest catch was Manuel Mestre - 323 Valencia games and several times manager. The most interesting is another Che, Sergio Manzanera, who subtly protested Franco in a game and thankfully got away with it as the dictator kicked the bucket while the case was awaiting judgement. He had to retire before 30, and became a dentist. I noticed that a lot of the Copa final articles put the link to Spanish Wikipedia as a blue link, which creates the illusion especially on mobile that the page already exists. Unknown Temptation (talk) 17:01, 14 October 2024 (UTC)

I made a CFD

I made a CFD, but as I stated there, this was unilaterally done. I really don't think a CFD was needed given WP:DIFFUSE. Anyway, please chime in over there Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2024_October_27#Category:British_male_tennis_players Mason (talk) 02:05, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for your co-operation. I just feel that given this is a topic which can arouse emotion in some and is technically complicated in other aspects, it would be better if there is a consensus somewhere to point to rather than just someone deciding one thing, then a few year later someone else decides the opposite, etc (not that such CfD decisions are set in stone for all time anyway, of course...) Crowsus (talk) 02:17, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Ok. I've not found diffusing English/Scottish/Welsh people to be contentious. I think though in the future, if you're going to ask for one, you should make the post to CFD rather than just mass reverting and waiting for someone else to do it. Mason (talk) 02:31, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Its certainly a potentially contentious topic, and absolutely for the pages I spotted the change on - just look at Talk:Andy Murray for the frothing, babbling and silent IP to-ing and fro-ing over many years over whether he is Scottish / British / both; although I agree nobody seems fussed by the categories in comparison to what's in the infobox and/or lead.

On the other point, to be honest you're the one removing the category against what was an longstanding instruction on the page until you changed it in the past 24 hours - you've decided it's wrong (and as I've said, I see where you're coming from and that too may have been an individual's preference many years ago) so it's not really waiting for 'someone else', just for you who made the push to change it, and you've now done so, perfect, so now it's not just me, you, Zyxw or any one individual who decides, surely that's the best outcome. Crowsus (talk) 02:46, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Sorry what I meant was that'd even though it could be contentious, I've almost never run into it in practice. But yes, cfd is definitely the right move here. (Anyway, what I had intended to do when popping over to your talk page, was to tell you that you can make a null edit to a category that uses any of those category header templates. That null edit will force the template to recheck for categories that are new. etc)^SMason_Garrison 13:36, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Non-diffusing subcategories

Hi there! Please don't move articles from a general to a gender/ethnicity-based subcategory - those can be added, but they are non-diffusing per WP:ALLINCLUDED so the broader cat shouldn't be removed. Nikkimaria (talk) 00:00, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Nikkimaria:. Sportswomen is a subcategory of both Women, and Sportspeople. There would need to be 3 categories then??? And 3 more for the ethnicity in applicable articles? Crowsus (talk) 00:06, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Two: diffusing women to sportswomen is fine because both are gendered, but you still need the sportspeople. Nikkimaria (talk) 01:37, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Nikkimaria: should the men be organised this way too? From going through these yesterday, many editors are not following this guideline; typically most of the Sportspeople are men who haven't been added to Sportsmen, and while some women are present, it's a mix of some not gendered and some doubled (but not all of those that are in the Sportswomen). Crowsus (talk) 07:35, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

FYI: sportspeople aren't non-diffusing by gender. But, yes, multiple enthinicities does mean that they're in a lot of categories ^SMason_Garrison 13:30, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Never mind the ethnicities for now, I think the pair of you need to discuss the situation with the gender please, as you appear to have sincere,concrete but completely opposite opinions on how they should be applied. Crowsus (talk) 13:38, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Lol, fair enough. I suspect that this question has been litigated somewhere. It's just a matter of finding the CFD where this was all hassed out. ^SMason_Garrison 13:54, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Would definitely be interested in seeing that CfD, but to answer Crowsus' question: yes, whichever organization is appropriate, it would be applied the same to both sportsmen and sportswomen. Nikkimaria (talk) 00:09, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

I concur with everything you've written here. Unfortunately, I'm swamped with two job searches in our department. (And I'm using Wikipedia to make mindless gnome edits.) But I do think that WP:CATGENDER has language on this about models, actors, and sportspeople. ^SMason_Garrison 00:31, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

Thanks, that does seem to be the place. "As most notable organized sporting activities are segregated by gender, sportsperson categories constitute a case where "gender has a specific relation to the topic". As such, sportsperson categories should be split by gender, except in such cases where men and women participate primarily in mixed-gender competition" is along the same lines as I was thinking to myself yesterday after you mentioned it: I do understand the gendering rules exist to denote women in traditionally male-dominated environments but avoid ghettoising them (as with the ethnicities), but the gender is a fundamental aspect of sport and so there is an equal split of participants between males and females, so that whole issue does not apply. It is really just dividing them into men and women as their occupations also do explicitly. Crowsus (talk) 08:20, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for creating Willie Moffat

He was my great grandfather and I was so proud when I found out he won the Scottish league. My family all thank you :) TagPro129 (talk) 14:39, 6 November 2024 (UTC)

@TagPro129: thanks, really great to read that! Please let me know if anything seems wrong, obviously I want it to be accurate but it can be difficult to find stuff from that era (and sometimes the wrong info has already been added elsewhere so becomes 'fact'. Crowsus (talk) 16:48, 6 November 2024 (UTC)

Category:21st-century African-American sportsmen has been nominated for deletion

Category:21st-century African-American sportsmen has been nominated for deletion. A discussion is taking place to decide whether it complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. User:Namiba 18:19, 6 November 2024 (UTC)

• Do not modify other editors nominations, as you recently did with mine.--User:Namiba 17:21, 7 November 2024 (UTC)

CfD nomination at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2024 November 7 § Category:Buildings and structures by decade of destruction

A category or categories you have created have been nominated for possible deletion, merging, or renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2024 November 7 § Category:Buildings and structures by decade of destruction on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. BlasterOfHouses (HouseBlaster's alt • talk • he/they) 17:38, 7 November 2024 (UTC)

Categorising 'Scottish sportsmen'

Please can you calm/slow down these edits? You have swamped my watchlist. GiantSnowman 07:40, 16 November 2024 (UTC)

I echo this, it's pretty challenging to evaluate your category changes when you massively move people into sportsmen categories. ^SMason_Garrison 23:20, 16 November 2024 (UTC)

WTF are you even talking about? Crowsus (talk) 23:23, 16 November 2024 (UTC)

Please slow down, I've already raised concerns about you moving ungendered cricketer categories. The solution isn't to remove women from the cricketer tree. It's to make a male cricketer tree. You'd be isolating women entirely from the tree. ^SMason_Garrison 23:26, 16 November 2024 (UTC)^SMason_Garrison 23:26, 16 November 2024 (UTC)

I've asked you to slow down and discuss before you make a unilateral change. ^SMason_Garrison 23:38, 16 November 2024 (UTC)

It's not from the entire tree, there is Category:Women Twenty20 International cricketers (slightly wrong name BRW, the competition is Women's Twenty20 International). If you want to make a male cricketer tree, please do so. Look at the way cricket is arranged for categories, it's still the 'old way' of the males just being Cricketers and the females being Women's cricketers. That probably isn't desirable, but it would be a big move to make, ideally with a bot and probably with a discussion about it all first. But if I (or anyone else) creates Category:Men's Twenty20 International cricketers at present it would be a complete outlier for this sport. The error was to include the Women lists as a subgroup of the main lists when they were created, but then again I see they have been shoved in as a subcat in almost every aspect of (men's) cricket so really it was following the standard pattern. But, you know what? ultimately I don't care about cricket whatsoever, nor about the sportspeople by century things, So I'll just put it all back and let someone else sort out the mess. But the Victorian cricketers are all men, there's no debate there. Crowsus (talk) 23:53, 16 November 2024 (UTC)

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I have sent you a note about a page you started

Hi Crowsus. Thank you for your work on Mildmay line. Another editor, North8000, has reviewed it as part of new pages patrol and left the following comment:

Good start. And good upmerge destination for non-wp:notable station articles.

To reply, leave a comment here and begin it with {{Re|North8000}}. (Message delivered via the Page Curation tool, on behalf of the reviewer.)

North8000 (talk) 22:14, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

Hi, this is not my work, I created it as a redirect with no involvement since, it was fleshed out into an article by User:Chessrat, all observations good and bad should be directed to them please.... Crowsus (talk) 15:10, 23 November 2024 (UTC)

Bilbao Athletic

You are posting false information and misinforming readers: Bilbao Athletic has always been officially called that. The term "B" or "C" is only a generic way of naming the lower teams of the same club in Spain, but it has never been the official name of this team, NEVER. Gabossi (talk) 14:58, 25 November 2024 (UTC)

Fix the Spanish page first then. It is pretty emphatic about these names. The RFEF still calls it that while other teams are called by different names. Crowsus (talk) 17:34, 25 November 2024 (UTC)

2018 Supercopa de Catalunya deletion

Hi Crowsus,

I noticed that you've suggested my article on the 2018 Supercopa de Catalunya for deletion. I’d like to propose an alternative approach. Rather than deleting it or merging it with the main Supercopa article, could we track its page views for a few months? Since it was created, the article has already received 162 views (including redirects), which suggests it isn’t entirely useless. I recommend monitoring its performance over the next 3-6 months, and if it doesn’t attract a reasonable number of views during that time, we can revisit the decision to delete it. Thank you in advance!

Best, Editor 11927 (talk) 05:57, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

Just making sure on Olympic categories

Since you said in a recent deleted category, "Upmerge to Category:English Olympic competitors, Category:Scottish Olympic competitors and Category:Welsh Olympic competitors respectively. Couldn't be simpler" Then I assume you are going to fully support a creation of Category:Californian Olympic competitors and Category:Floridian Olympic competitors? Because if not I plan on nominating those competitor categories for deletion as we just did to Category:English Olympic medallists et al. Fyunck(click) (talk) 05:04, 27 November 2024 (UTC)

If you had read it properly, I wrote the Olympians categories should also probably be deleted. What a waste of time trying to catch me out or something. Plan away. Crowsus (talk) 05:23, 27 November 2024 (UTC)

Sorry, I didn't mean it that way. I thought it was a different editor that wrote the other categories should probably be deleted. You have two different bolded headers in the discussion... one you said to merge (which I read but didn't realize it was you) and the last one which I noticed by name simply said to upmerge. Most of the time it's usually one bolded suggestion per editor with the rest being replies that are not bolded entries. Fyunck(click) (talk) 18:55, 27 November 2024 (UTC)

OK thanks, no worries. Crowsus (talk) 19:07, 27 November 2024 (UTC)