User talk:The Four Deuces

Antifs

WP:NPOVN? Doug Weller talk 17:39, 7 September 2024 (UTC)

Perhaps hold off for a while and see if we make any progess. TFD (talk) 00:13, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

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Not OC; Trying to find more sources

I'm not doing original research, rather I'm looking for more sources on how Republicans love the rich but hate the well-educated. This is the single best explanation I've found for why Republican voters support wealthy candidates like Trump, and why those wealthy candidates rail against "elites" (the well-educated). I've already done in-depth analysis of the Democratic Party's core base being the well-educated and African Americans.

The idea that Republican voters perceive the Democratic Party as more "elitist" is best-explained from the metric of education, not income or wealth. Republican voters appear to both love the wealthy and hate the well-educated, especially those with graduate degrees. The urban-rural divide is a big part of this, with the "elites" being the so-called urban/metropolitan Liberal elite. Increasing population density is strongly correlated with increasing educational attainment.

Likewise, well-educated Democratic voters with high incomes don't support Republicans because they perceive the Republican Party's positions on social issues that correlate to educational attainment as antithetical to their ideological values.

• Support for abortion, environmentalism, LGBT rights, etc. increases as educational attainment decreases.

I've got some sources, but am looking for more, both statistical and qualitative sources. Specifically, even those with Bachelor's degrees are closely split, and Trump won Whites with Bachelor's degrees in 2016.

• Just 13.7% of American adults over 25 had a graduate degree in 2021, which is about the same as the African American population.

This was from 2016:

• "First, it’s clear from the exit polls that for white voters, every bit of extra education meant less support for Trump. That is, it wasn’t just a matter of attending college or getting a degree. While much has been made of the college and non-college divide (which is stark), Trump actually won whites who earned only a bachelor’s degree by a fairly wide margin. Just as big a gap was between the votes of those who graduated from college and those who went to graduate school. The latter group supported Clinton in much larger numbers."

Link: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/even-among-the-wealthy-education-predicts-trump-support/

The Gallup poll showing Republican confidence in higher education decreasing from 56% in 2015 (pre-Trump) to 39% in 2018 (Trump 1st term) to 19% in 2023 (Biden) was also useful. For Democrats, the decline was from 68% in 2015, to 62% in 2018, to 59% in 2023.

Link: https://news.gallup.com/poll/508352/americans-confidence-higher-education-down-sharply.aspx JohnAdams1800 (talk) 19:29, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

If you are looking for sources to explain why Republicans love the rich etc. you are engaging in original research. Therefore, none of what you find can be used in the article. If you doubt that, ask at WP:NORN.

The reason why most Republicans and Democrats appear to favour the rich is based on liberal principles of freedom and individualism. People who build businesses should be encouraged while lazy people should be discouraged or encouraged to better themselves.

Anti-elitism comes from the populist belief that the elites have betrayed them, in favor of internal and external enemies.

As I said, there is extensive literature about this which you should read before coming to your own conclusions. I would recommend Lipset's American Exceptionalism. which I mentioned before and The Radical Right edited by Daniel Bell. If nothing else, they will show that scholars have been on the case for decades.

Also, there are many drivers for voting behaviour. To do a proper analysis, you would need to start with a large sample size, determine and quantify all the variables, and perform linear regression analysis. You should then publish your findings so that others can evaluate your methodology and try to re-run your tests. Or you can just accept the findings of people who have already done that. TFD (talk) 20:44, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

2008 House elections

2010 House elections

I only added the results of the Gallup poll from 2015 to 2023 on higher education to the Republican Party article. I'm not planning to add any subjective claims on Republican/Democratic voters on whether they love/hate the rich or well-educated without finding RS for such claims. Instead I'm trying to understand why class Dealignment has occurred, with Democrats doing better among the higher-income except for the top 1%, while Republicans are doing better among the lower-income except for the very poorest (i.e. African Americans).

Specifically, why is the Republican Party is doing better among those with less education despite them having lower incomes, while the Democratic Party is doing better among those with more education despite them having higher incomes? Donald Trump and Elon Musk only have a Bachelor's degree while being billionaires, while Harris (J.D.) and Walz (MS) had graduate degrees. Inflation is the most obvious explanation for this, with the higher-income benefitting from higher asset prices, while the lower-income don't while having to pay higher prices. But fundamentally, it appears that those with less education prefer populist billionaires (Trump and Musk) over technocratic lawyers/educators (Harris and Walz).

• In the 2024 presidential election, Harris won whites with college degrees 52-45%, while Trump won whites without college degrees 66-32%. Harris also won voters making over $100,000 (51-46%) and $200,000 (52-46%) and voters making less than $30,000 (50-46%), while Trump won voters making $30,000-99,999 (52-46%).
• By education, Trump won high school or less (62-36%), some college (51-47%), and Associate's degree (57-41%), while Harris won Bachelor's degree (53-45%) and Postgraduate degree (59-38%). This is a much stronger and clearer correlation than income.

Per Polarized by Degrees and exit polls, Republicans had majority support from White voters with college degrees until 2016. Also a quote from the book: "While populist rhetoric often attacks a cabal of nefarious "elites" that is not always well-defined, the white working class seems to resent highly educated professionals but admire wealthy businesspeople."

Regarding Lipset's American Exceptionalism (1997) and The Radical Right edited by Daniel Bell (2001), they are much older than the Trump era. And Democrats had much stronger support from non-college Whites before the Trump era.

• Until 2010, Democrats were still competitive in the Southern United States at the state and local level. I've been the main editor of Solid South, and it wasn't until the 2010s that Republicans finally began to dominate Southern politics. See the maps of the 2008 and 2010 U.S. House elections, when Obama was first elected and his first midterm election. Republicans didn't control a majority of Southern U.S. House seats until 1994, and a majority of Southern state legislatures until 2011.

Book Links: Bell ; Lipset ; Polarized by Degrees JohnAdams1800 (talk) 21:36, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

I explained it before. Both wealth and education are drivers that determine how people vote. The wealthier you are, the more likely you are to vote Republican, while the better educated you are, the more likely to are to vote Democratic.

The effect of wealth is shown by voting by the top 1% voting Republican and the bottom quintile voting Democratic.

Education is becoming a more important driver as both parties converge on economic policy. More educated people tend to be more tolerant of minorities so are more likely to vote Democratic. At the same time, there is a correlation between wealth and education. Doctors earn more than cleaners for example. That does not mean that the wealthier one is, the more likely one is to vote Democratic. Of course there are other drivers as well, such as region and religion.

Trump has not reversed the fact that lower income correlates to voting Democratic.

Also, the two parties have over time polarized along left-right axes. When FDR was president, southern Democrats aligned with some northern Republicans in a conservative coalition. So in the South, region was a better predictor of voting than wealth or education. TFD (talk) 22:09, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Happy Holidays

Merry Christmas and a Prosperous 2025!

Hello The Four Deuces, may you be surrounded by peace, success and happiness on this seasonal occasion. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Sending you heartfelt and warm greetings for Christmas and New Year 2025. Happy editing, Abishe (talk) 23:01, 24 December 2024 (UTC) Spread the love by adding {{subst:Seasonal Greetings}} to other user talk pages.

Abishe (talk) 23:01, 24 December 2024 (UTC)